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Get the hell out of… my face!

by Kafir ( 126 Comments › )
Filed under Anti-semitism, Dhimmitude, Islamic hypocrisy, Islamic Supremacism, Islamic Terrorism, Islamists, Israel, Politics at June 9th, 2010 - 2:00 pm

The following is reprinted in full with permission.

Get the Hell Out of…My Face
By Sara K. Eisen

Here’s the thing. I’ve been thinking about poor Helen Thomas, who I believe was probably just saying what everyone thinks and has therefore been made a scapegoat. Not that I really care, because we ought to share the scapegoat status once in a while. It’s the least we can do to dispel the stereotype that we are stingy, us irritating Jews.

Irritating enough, apparently – like the too-talented and bossy fame-hog Rachel Berry (Lea Michele) on Fox’s Glee – in our discovery of the written word, monotheism, modern physics, psychology, vaccinations, and the film industry, that every country that has ever “hosted” us has found it necessary to tell us to get the hell out, like Thomas did. (Ironically, the aforementioned Jewish character Rachel, in a particularly annoying moment in one episode, was told by classmates to move to Israel. I doubt the writers coordinated this telling joke – Jews do equal Israel in the eyes of the world, sorry J Street – with the State Department.)

Helen, you know why we were in Germany and much of Eastern Europe in the first place? (And by the way, if I follow your advice, do you think the nice old ladies who got my grandmothers’ large houses and farms from the Nazis in what was once Czechoslovakia will kick the property back two generations? That would be cool because I’d love a vineyard and an agricultural estate.)

We were in Germany and Hungary and Czechoslovakia and Russia (where we were regularly just plain killed by Cossacks), and also, for many centuries, Poland (ditto), because we were told to get the hell out of England, France, and Spain. (Or, you know, just plain killed by handsome and heroic fairytale knights.)

And you know why we were in Western Europe to begin with? Because we were told by the Greeks and the Romans – wait for it – to get the hell out of “Palestine,” where we had been living since the beginning of recorded history.

We also ended up in Babylonia (Iraq) and other Middle Eastern and North African countries, where we stayed as second class citizens for hundreds and hundreds of years, till the Arab world finally caught up with the pagans and the Christians in their hatred of the Jews. Amazing how the student has now far surpassed the teacher. But I digress.

(By the way, I am aware that the Arab narrative has us Ashkenazi Jews as descendants of the Khazars, but the actual facts have it different. See this new DNA study linking European Jews with their Middle Eastern counterparts, all stemming from one original population of Holy Land Jews predating Roman times. Never mind our own texts that say the same thing; I know they are inadmissible in the international courts of the mind.)

In any event, there is no way around it: Jews being asked (usually not by old ladies on the White House lawn) to get the hell out of anywhere and everywhere is just the way it goes.

So it came to pass that about 200 years BCE the Macabees got sick of it and established a Jewish state in Palestine, within the Roman Empire, which lasted till about the time of Jesus (another Pesky Jew) and the destruction of the Second Temple.

And it also came to pass that Jewish settlers began arriving in Ottoman Palestine in the late 1800’s, after the Russians and the Poles made it clear that Jews were persona non grata in Eastern Europe. Palestine was as good a place as any to escape to, since it was the last place, about 2000 years before, that the Jews had a sovereign state (see above). Never mind Jewish liturgy and texts pining for Jerusalem, since I know these, too, are inadmissible in the international courts of the mind.

Anyway, nowhere else wanted European Jews any more than Russia did, not even America really, where there were very strict quotas, although the Americans, again politely, refrained from all the messy European killing, which was apparently in vogue until after Hitler. Besides, those Ottoman Turks, as now, were known around the world for their amazing human rights activism and the Jews were excited to see it first hand. (No, not really. But…they were better than the Polish peasants. Unless you were Armenian.)

It is true that there were people in Palestine before the Jews arrived en masse (for there was always a handful of Jews that remained here….), not ‘A People,’ but rather a group of assorted regional Arabs (think Native American tribes in North America…who by the way were treated much worse by the Colonialists…) who had settled the area with not much agricultural success and had endured various rulers over the millennia.

But when the Jews came back, it was suddenly necessary, once again, to tell them to get the hell out. There was no living side by side, even though that was an express Jewish desire right up until 1947/8, when the Partition Plan was summarily rejected by the Arab League, who started the war that Israel won. If keeping land you win in a war others provoke (when you wanted to make peace) is called occupation, Helen, the world’s axis of furious justice has a lot bigger fish to fry than Israel.

The Arab desire to kick the Jews the hell out of Palestine did not begin in 1967, and not in 1948. It began the moment the initial groups of Jews arrived and started to make the land flower and produce crops. That’s when the attacks on Jews began, and when the Arab world decided a new Jewish presence in the land would not do, back when there were about half a million Arabs and just under 100,000 Jews in the Holy Land, in the early 1900’s. Twenty percent was too much, apparently, to bear. (The Hebron Massacre of 1929, where marauding Arabs killed nearly 70 Jews and wounded countless others, took place long before a single house was built over the Green Line.) I can only imagine how awful it was – probably for both the Arabs and the British – when it became clear we were here to stay and grow to much further percentages. We are that annoying, what with trying to get rid of malaria and tuberculosis and everything.

At any rate, it seems that every time a Jewish minority starts to make a society too successful – so annoying!!!! – the indigenous people start to feel very uncomfortable, and tells them one way or another to get the hell out.

But now, alas, there is nowhere left for us to go, except the eternal place Ahmadinejad wants us to go, and Haniyeh and Nasralla, and Hitler before them, and Chemilniki before him, and Haman before him, and so on. And, I suspect, in her heart of hearts, perhaps Thomas and the likes of her, who, the pesky Jew Freud may have observed, seriously let her slip show.

Let me make it clear: I know that Israel has made mistakes over its 62 years, some clumsy and inept (was there no intelligence regarding the terrorists aboard the Mavi Marmara?!?), and some borderline immoral. But none worse than every other democracy on earth has also done, and most much better than the large majority of the UN rogue nations which condemn Israel daily have done…daily. There is MUCH to improve in the way we govern, I will be the first to say it. I will also be the first to say that various Jews of the Bernie Madoff and Greed-is-Good-Goldman-Sachs ilk make me want to crawl under a rock. I know that the world is only waiting for these guys to emerge in order to pin their crimes on all of us, even though everything they do is in direct contradiction of actual Jewish values.

But let’s be honest: the international community’s human rights crusades on behalf of the Palestinians are just the latest Crusades, and the ones who REALLY suffer are not the Jews or the Israelis but the poor occupants of the Third World who are ignored while the enlightened First World castigates the Jews… and yes, of course, the Palestinians, who are kept in misery by their own leadership in order to provide the polite Jew haters with a media club to beat them with.

So here’s the thing: We are not going anywhere this time, Helen. We totally get it: Ya’ll pretty much hate us. It’s just the way it is, like a natural law. Nothing we can do – not giving away pieces of Palestine / Israel (witness our evacuation of Gaza in 2005, and handing over the keys to army bases and greenhouses- a new economy! Food for the children! – which were summarily torched as property of the infidels); not donating billions annually to global charity, nor discovering a cure for Polio or the Theory of Relativity, or writing revered legal and religious texts, or co-founding Google, or manufacturing the microprocessor in the majority of laptops that spew Jew hatred to the Internet, or founding Christianity itself, or championing women’s rights and gay rights in the US and helping to bring about a human rights revolution in America in the 60’s. None of those things will absolve us of our real sin: Existing and overcoming.

I’m really sorry they told you to get the hell out of the White House, Helen. It really wasn’t your fault that you thought you could say what you said. It’s not like it’s a secret: That’s what people think.

But this time, seriously. Getting the hell out is not in the cards. We’re just sick of moving all the time.

I know. Irritating.

Sara K. Eisen is a freelance copywriter, journalist and editor who blogs at http://the-word-well.com/

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126 Responses to “Get the hell out of… my face!”
( jump to bottom )

  1. BuddyG
    1 | June 9, 2010 2:07 pm

    God bless Israel. May she survie and thrive.


  2. BuddyG
    2 | June 9, 2010 2:08 pm

    v


  3. 3 | June 9, 2010 2:11 pm

    Logic and facts will only confuse and confound the pro-mooslim people. Their agenda will not be swayed one whit by such eloquence.


  4. Silhouette
    4 | June 9, 2010 2:16 pm

    Laughing at work is one thing. Now my co-workers are wondering why I stood up and gave a standing ovation to my computer screen.


  5. citizen_q
    5 | June 9, 2010 2:17 pm

    FurryOldGuyJeans wrote:

    Logic and facts will only confuse and confound the pro-mooslim people. Their agenda will not be swayed one whit by such eloquence.

    It is still very good to hear!


  6. Speranza
    6 | June 9, 2010 2:17 pm

    As a supplement to this thread -- Doctrr Zero at hot air has this

    No Country for Old Hens

    It’s easy to see the contemptible end of Helen Thomas’ career as a metaphor for the twilight of the entire dinosaur media. Her departure is the latest tremor in a rapidly shifting print and television landscape. This is no country for old hens.
    Fellow Green Room contributor Karl’s fine roundup of media reaction to the Thomas retirement includes a quote from Jonah Goldberg of National Review, making the point that Helen Thomas has been “a nasty piece of work” for a long time. Why did the White House press corps spend decades reserving an honorary seat for an ancient lunatic? Press briefings are a structural chokepoint that new media can’t bypass – there are only so many seats available, and only so much time the President and his spokespeople can devote to answering questions. What purpose was served by allowing Helen Thomas to squat in one of those precious seats like Jabba the Hutt’s nasty little imp, hooting and screaming incomprehensible insults at everyone who got tossed into the monster pit?
    A portion of the blame lies with every Administration – Democrat, Republican, and Whig – which tolerated her presence, when they could have asked for her removal, or simply shoved her into the back of the room and ignored her. The White House refrained from doing this as a courtesy to the media… or, perhaps, as a concession to self-important journalists who loveopportunities to hail their colleagues as First Amendment martyrs.
    This is the kind of cozy, elitist collegiality that transforms the mainstream media into an arm of the epic super-government they worship. The media might be only the Fourth Estate, but it’s the estate us common folks have to cross, in order to learn anything important about our ruling class… and the grounds of that estate are dotted with exclusive lawn parties we are pointedly not invited to attend.
    The fall of Helen Thomas is a sign the New Media have crashed those genteel lawn parties, clad in combat pajamas and digital beer hats, asking rude questions about the hosts and laughing at their sputtering indignation. The New Media doesn’t stand on ceremony. Its elder statesmen, talk radio pioneers like Rush Limbaugh, have spent their entire careers being insulted and disrespected by the mainstream press. The same political and opinion elite that indulged decades of insane prattle from Helen Thomas, politely ignoring some of her worst outbursts, was quick to trumpet fraudulent accusations of racism against Limbaugh for things he never said, to paint him as unfit for association with a professional football team. Such relentless assaults build thick skin, and sharp wits. The New Media breeds gladiators, and has little patience for deans and doyennes.


  7. vagabond trader
    7 | June 9, 2010 2:29 pm

    Send this to all your dopey Jewish progressive friends and relatives.


  8. snork
    8 | June 9, 2010 2:33 pm

    Silhouette wrote:

    Laughing at work is one thing. Now my co-workers are wondering why I stood up and gave a standing ovation to my computer screen.

    Watching “we con the world”? :grin:


  9. vagabond trader
    9 | June 9, 2010 2:34 pm

    @ vagabond trader:

    A portion of the blame lies with every Administration – Democrat, Republican, and Whig – which tolerated her presence, when they could have asked for her removal

    The Whigs,lol. :lol:


  10. vagabond trader
    10 | June 9, 2010 2:35 pm

    @ Speranza:

    9 was at you Speranza.


  11. 11 | June 9, 2010 2:35 pm

    Technically the Maccabean Revolt was against the Seleucid Empire, not the Roman. And if Judaea got its independence, it couldn’t quite maintain its own territorial integrity -- because the Seleucids kept raiding the place and calling upon Jewish armies to help out their own civil wars -- until the Romans put the Seleucids out of the Near East’s misery.

    (I always get a headache when I read about Hellenistic-era events. I see that Wikipedia’s Seleucid article doesn’t even bother for the 100-63 BC span.)

    Other than that, excellent article.


  12. 12 | June 9, 2010 2:38 pm

    Wow, that’s a great article and very well said.


  13. 13 | June 9, 2010 2:42 pm

    Helen Thomas’ resignation had nothing to do with shame. A furore over Jews was an excellent issue over which to martyr herself. The left’s accepted view of the incident will be that the Jewish Lobby will be seen to have silenced a brave critic of Israel -- once again. The Thomas affair will be adduced as evidence of the power of the Jews in manipulating government and the media. Helen Thomas will be a hot item on the lecture circuit. She has just supplemented her pension by thousands.

    The return to Europe and America of Jews is the foundational idea of the Palestinian national aspiration. Let’s see whether the NYT traces the connection.


  14. citizen_q
    14 | June 9, 2010 2:43 pm

    @ vagabond trader:
    I laughed at that too.


  15. Speranza
    16 | June 9, 2010 2:49 pm

    vagabond trader wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    9 was at you Speranza.

    Lol. I twas a funny line!


  16. Speranza
    17 | June 9, 2010 2:49 pm

    @ blueiris:
    Yeah because America is doing so well financially what’s $400 million to a terrorist pseudo state?


  17. 18 | June 9, 2010 2:50 pm

    Overlook wrote:

    Helen Thomas will be a hot item on the lecture circuit.

    Really? If she were 20 years younger, maybe. But I don’t see her doing tours around the country. She’ll pop up in the occasional Georgetown “Peace And Tolerance” event which the Wahhabis like to sponsor.

    Otherwise she’s pretty much got a future at home with a few live-in nurses. (I’m not even trying to be mean; this is the fate of all of us who live to the age of 89 -- if we’re lucky.)


  18. buzzsawmonkey
    19 | June 9, 2010 2:51 pm

    Let us not forget that Obama is in political debt to Hamas, since they worked to help him get elected.


  19. Speranza
    20 | June 9, 2010 2:52 pm

    I don’t know why every author including the one whose piece we are using has to give the obligatory “I am not saying that Israel is perfect or has not done some bad things during her lifetime” -- duh granted nobody or nation is perfect, no need to burnish your credentials by stating the obvious.


  20. vagabond trader
    21 | June 9, 2010 2:53 pm

    Bernie Madoff or any other Jewish crook isn’t our guilt to bear. Besides most of those he fleeced were hard left progressives like the ACLU.Such is life.


  21. blueiris
    22 | June 9, 2010 2:53 pm

    @ blueiris:

    Mr. Obama, meeting with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas at the White House, said that the money would go to housing and schools. White House officials said that the money also would help increase access to drinking water and to help address health and infrastructure needs.

    The Palestinians don’t give a damn about their own infrastructure and everyone knows it. It’s in the terrorists interest to keep the populace angry.


  22. Speranza
    23 | June 9, 2010 2:53 pm

    Zimriel wrote:

    Really? If she were 20 years younger, maybe. But I don’t see her doing tours around the country. She’ll pop up in the occasional Georgetown “Peace And Tolerance” event which the Wahhabis like to sponsor.

    Otherwise she’s pretty much got a future at home with a few live-in nurses. (I’m not even trying to be mean; this is the fate of all of us who live to the age of 89 – if we’re lucky.)

    Who knows maybe al-Jazeera will hire her as a part time commentator. I am sure she has a huge pension and nobody will have to pass the hat for the old biddy.


  23. RIX
    24 | June 9, 2010 2:54 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    Let us not forget that Obama is in political debt to Hamas, since they worked to help him get elected.

    Yup, they were actually making phone calls to U.S voters.
    Now that the election is over , I think that they have segued to the call center for United Airlines.
    I can’t understand them.


  24. Speranza
    25 | June 9, 2010 2:54 pm

    vagabond trader wrote:

    Bernie Madoff or any other Jewish crook isn’t our guilt to bear. Besides most of those he fleeced were hard left progressives like the ACLU.Such is life.

    He fleeced plenty of Jewish charitable organizations too. He is a sociopathic monster whom being killed in prison is too easy and good for him.


  25. vagabond trader
    26 | June 9, 2010 2:54 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Get outta my head! The same goes for Jewish thugs. Seriously, if you want to beat up your tribe go for the progs. Now they are a scourge!


  26. 27 | June 9, 2010 2:59 pm

    @ blueiris:

    The money goes to the PA in the West Bank. How it will benefit Gazans is unclear. Perhaps Abbas will bribe Hamas supporters to defect to Fatah. Why does the US continue to support a unified Palestinian state in Gaza and the West Bank?
    Wait for the peace process to expand to a three-state solution: Hamasstan (Gaza), Fatahland (West Bank) and Palestine (Israel).


  27. buzzsawmonkey
    28 | June 9, 2010 3:01 pm

    RIX wrote:

    Yup, they were actually making phone calls to U.S voters.

    One of the fundamental rules of machine politics is that you reward those who work for you. To expect Obama to do anything other than favor Hamas is delusional.


  28. vagabond trader
    29 | June 9, 2010 3:02 pm

    @ Speranza:

    A list of the biggies.I’m no financial mogul but mother always told me if it sounds too good to be true…..

    http://s.wsj.net/public/resources/documents/st_madoff_victims_20081215.html


  29. RIX
    30 | June 9, 2010 3:02 pm

    see ya


  30. Silhouette
    31 | June 9, 2010 3:05 pm

    @ blueiris:

    Sure. Housing, schools, drinking water. Right.

    Just like all those funds given for the sanitation system that Hamas didn’t build. Had other uses for the money, you know.


  31. buzzsawmonkey
    32 | June 9, 2010 3:06 pm

    Silhouette wrote:

    Sure. Housing, schools, drinking water. Right.

    Even if the money were to be used for “housing, schools, drinking water,” the effect would merely be to free up other money for weapons and hostile activity.


  32. 33 | June 9, 2010 3:06 pm

    @ Speranza:

    More Schedule 80 SWD pipe from development projects to build Kasams with would be my guess.


  33. lobo91
    34 | June 9, 2010 3:07 pm

    @ RIX:

    Now that the election is over , I think that they have segued to the call center for United Airlines.
    I can’t understand them.

    You’ve had that experience too, huh?

    I do actually like their automated system that calls your cell phone to let you know when your flight’s been cancelled or something.

    I was sitting at the gate in Burlington VT back in February when it called to tell me my flight was cancelled. I let the other people sitting around me know about it, and we all started working on getting new flights.

    It was about an hour before a person actually showed up at the gate and officially notified us. We all had new flights booked before then.


  34. lobo91
    35 | June 9, 2010 3:08 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    More Schedule 80 SWD pipe from development projects to build Kasams with would be my guess.

    Mine too.

    And fertilizer to turn into explosives.


  35. snowcrash
    36 | June 9, 2010 3:12 pm

    I think CNN has a new excuse for Obamas detachment from the oil spill. We can’t handle an angry black man.
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/06/08/rage.obama/index.html?hpt=C1


  36. buzzsawmonkey
    37 | June 9, 2010 3:15 pm

    snowcrash wrote:

    I think CNN has a new excuse for Obamas detachment from the oil spill. We can’t handle an angry black man.
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/06/08/rage.obama/index.html?hpt=C1

    What nonsense. Obama, angry, does not come across as an “angry black man” in the Right Racist Reverend Wright mode; he comes across as a peevish, petulant, tantrum-prone child, angry because his auntie won’t let him win at Candyland.


  37. orangecrush
    38 | June 9, 2010 3:15 pm

    Islam has rights to what? To kill?

    In other news I hear that Helen Thomas posts at LGF as the nic known as Kilgore Trout.


  38. 39 | June 9, 2010 3:17 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    Even if the money were to be used for “housing, schools, drinking water,” t

    So now that we know how the money will be spent, I say $400 million is paltry, niggardly, insulting. Obama thinks he can buy off public opinion so cheaply? The international humanitarian community should demand 1000 times as much on behalf of the suffering Palestinians.


  39. orangecrush
    40 | June 9, 2010 3:17 pm

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KUcv452KbU

    We conned the world. Post it on your facebook page.


  40. snork
    41 | June 9, 2010 3:18 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    One of the fundamental rules of machine politics is that you reward those who work for you. To expect Obama to do anything other than favor Hamas is delusional.

    This is why I keep saying that BP will exit with skin intact. They paid their protection money. The Chicago code of honor will protect them. Pay no attention to all the populist noise; it’s a distraction.


  41. snowcrash
    42 | June 9, 2010 3:19 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    Other than how the spill cuts into his polling numbers and his social life, I think he really doesn’t care. He thinks the experts can take care of it. More voting “present”.


  42. buzzsawmonkey
    43 | June 9, 2010 3:22 pm

    snowcrash wrote:

    Other than how the spill cuts into his polling numbers and his social life, I think he really doesn’t care. He thinks the experts can take care of it. More voting “present”.

    Obama signed on for the coronation and the perks: he wanted to be First Black President, cut ribbons, make speeches, meet world leaders, and get to fly everywhere on the public dime. He did not sign on for the job, but only for the pomp that, in a serious Presidency, occasionally alleviates the tedium of the actual job.


  43. m
    45 | June 9, 2010 3:29 pm

    @ citizen_q:

    “We had made our move on the chessboard for cooperation and confidence building which was the Tehran declaration,” he said of a nuclear fuel swap deal signed on May 17 by Iran, Brazil and Turkey.

    It’s a friggen game to them. And the world plays along.


  44. yellow flag
    46 | June 9, 2010 3:34 pm

    A beautiful post. Thank you Sara K. Eisen. And, thank you m.


  45. 47 | June 9, 2010 3:34 pm

    snork wrote:

    BP will exit with skin intact.

    Didn’t the Wally predict the end of BP -- going bankrupt as a result of the spill? But the end of BP could be a US national take-over. Like GM. In the name of “protection”.

    The rationale “too big to fail” will be changed to “too poisonous to continue”.

    Big Oil and Big Motor are part of the CO2 threat. Their take-over by government is a prelude to using them to stop oil and gas-car production altogether. BP could be rededicated to windmills; GM to electric and chicken-shit-burning cars.

    Catastrophe = opportunity.


  46. buzzsawmonkey
    48 | June 9, 2010 3:39 pm

    Overlook wrote:

    Catastrophe = opportunity.

    That’s what we need: the Cat Ass Trophy™, awarded for the most disgustingly opportunistic advantage taken from the disasters of the year.


  47. snork
    49 | June 9, 2010 3:41 pm

    m wrote:

    It’s a friggen game to them. And the world plays along.

    It’s a stupid analogy, too. Chess, like war, is played to win.


  48. citizen_q
    50 | June 9, 2010 3:42 pm

    @ Overlook:

    That is one issue that I don’t understand. If they destroy BP, how will BP pay for and assist in the clean-up?


  49. 51 | June 9, 2010 3:43 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Zero is definately the cat’s ass.

    Isn’t that what Templars allegedly kissed to symbolize allegiance to Baphomet?


  50. citizen_q
    52 | June 9, 2010 3:44 pm

    snork wrote:

    m wrote:
    It’s a friggen game to them. And the world plays along.
    It’s a stupid analogy, too. Chess, like war, is played to win.

    They aim to win by creating the chaos that will usher in the 12th imam.

    Crazy as hatters they are.


  51. 53 | June 9, 2010 3:44 pm

    definitely…PIMF


  52. citizen_q
    54 | June 9, 2010 3:47 pm

    @ Scott Madsen:

    Zero is definately the cat’s ass.

    I always thought of him a being a winged horse’s ass, his name being buraq and all.


  53. citizen_q
    55 | June 9, 2010 3:48 pm

    citizen_q wrote:

    @ Scott Madsen:
    Zero is definately the cat’s ass.

    I always thought of him a being a winged horse’s ass, his name being buraq and all.

    Too bad he isn’t mythical as well.


  54. snork
    56 | June 9, 2010 3:50 pm

    Nobody’s breaking up BP. There’s a cap on liability, and this thing called ex-post facto. And, they’re paid up on their protection money. There’s a lot of noise, and there won’t be anything more.


  55. buzzsawmonkey
    57 | June 9, 2010 3:51 pm

    snork wrote:

    There’s a lot of noise, and there won’t be anything more.

    “A show for the rubes.”


  56. buzzsawmonkey
    58 | June 9, 2010 3:52 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    Zero is definately the cat’s ass.

    Isn’t that what Templars allegedly kissed to symbolize allegiance to Baphomet?

    I can’t speak to that, but when I hear Obama speak I do think of mountin’ lyin’.


  57. 59 | June 9, 2010 3:52 pm

    citizen_q wrote:

    citizen_q wrote:
    @ Scott Madsen:
    Zero is definately the cat’s ass.
    I always thought of him a being a winged horse’s ass, his name being buraq and all.
    Too bad he isn’t mythical as well.</blockquote>

    Indeed, I would have prefered him to stay at the bottom of his own little occluded well, or under the proverbial rock he crawled out from under.


  58. Ma Sands
    60 | June 9, 2010 3:53 pm

    Thank you, m. I tell ya, that history re-cap of Sara K. Eisen’s, is such a vivid portrayal of how the hand of God has been with the Hebrews from the beginning. Loved her Biblical phrases, “It came to pass…” and such. She brings the narrative up to the present. It has been foretold to the very last chapter, into the future --and the Jews indeed do endure. : )


  59. calcajun
    61 | June 9, 2010 3:55 pm

    vagabond trader wrote:

    @ vagabond trader:
    A portion of the blame lies with every Administration – Democrat, Republican, and Whig – which tolerated her presence, when they could have asked for her removal
    The Whigs,lol.

    or, the more appropriate “Know-Nothings”.


  60. calcajun
    62 | June 9, 2010 3:57 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    Scott Madsen wrote:
    Zero is definately the cat’s ass.
    Isn’t that what Templars allegedly kissed to symbolize allegiance to Baphomet?
    I can’t speak to that, but when I hear Obama speak I do think of mountin’ lyin’.

    I think you need some lynx to back that up


  61. Nevergiveup
    63 | June 9, 2010 3:58 pm

    Good afternoon all. I finally got some stuff done today. So anything new and exciting in the world?


  62. Nevergiveup
    64 | June 9, 2010 4:00 pm

    President Obama promised a $400 million aid package for the West Bank and Gaza on Wednesday, as the United States scrambled to come up with a way out of the stalemate in the Middle East exacerbated by the Gaza flotilla incident last week.

    Mr. Obama, meeting with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas at the White House, said that the money would go to housing and schools. White House officials said that the money also would help increase access to drinking water and to help address health and infrastructure needs.

    The exact details of how such aid would be used in Gaza remained unclear. Nor was it immediately clear how Mr. Abbas, who has authority in the West Bank but no authority in Gaza, would be able to administer it.

    Is he fuckin kidding?


  63. Nevergiveup
    65 | June 9, 2010 4:02 pm

    Hezbollah stands by disgraced US reporter Helen Thomas
    Published: 06.09.10, 21:09 / Israel News
    Hezbollah on Wednesday saluted veteran US reporter Helen Thomas’s “courage” for her controversial comments against Israel, which sparked a furor and forced her to retire.

    “Respected American journalist Helen Thomas’s answer shows … a courageous, bold, honest and free opinion which expresses what people across the globe believe: that Israel is a racist state of murderers and thugs,” Hezbollah MP Hussein Moussawi said in a statement. (AFP)

    They supported Obama in the last election also didn’t they?


  64. 66 | June 9, 2010 4:03 pm

    Ma Sands wrote:

    Thank you, m. I tell ya, that history re-cap of Sara K. Eisen’s, is such a vivid portrayal of how the hand of God has been with the Hebrews from the beginning. Loved her Biblical phrases, “It came to pass…” and such. She brings the narrative up to the present. It has been foretold to the very last chapter, into the future –and the Jews indeed do endure. : )

    Infinite Promise to His People.

    Current events cause me to wonder if the Promise will have me, or someone like me, sitting post atop a dumpster aginst the parking lot wall of the local Lubavitcher Center on a Friday night, with an AR15 in my lap like some updated comtemporary Shabbas Goy.


  65. 67 | June 9, 2010 4:07 pm

    Nevergiveup wrote:

    The exact details of how such aid would be used in Gaza remained unclear.

    Intellectual dishonesty at it pinnacle, only those who are self-deceived are unclear how an organization whose charter openly declares it sole reason for existing is to destroy Israel and kill Jewish people could believe that how such aid would be used in Gaza is unclear.


  66. buzzsawmonkey
    68 | June 9, 2010 4:07 pm

    calcajun wrote:

    I think you need some lynx to back that up

    I’ll see if my friend Bob Katz can help.


  67. 69 | June 9, 2010 4:07 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    It would be nice if Zero would “break me off some” instead of breaking it off in me.


  68. Nevergiveup
    70 | June 9, 2010 4:08 pm

    @ Scott Madsen:
    Hey I know from stuff you have said here that you were in Israel alot in the past. How come? I kinda spent 2 summers as an exchange student in their dental School and then just went back almost every year to visit friends. You?


  69. Nevergiveup
    71 | June 9, 2010 4:09 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Nevergiveup:

    It would be nice if Zero would “break me off some” instead of breaking it off in me.

    You and me both.


  70. citizen_q
    72 | June 9, 2010 4:10 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    These faux complaints by muslims are all projection. They are much more accurate as self-description then a depiction of their enemies.


  71. 73 | June 9, 2010 4:13 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Nevergiveup:
    It would be nice if Zero would “break me off some” instead of breaking it off in me.

    Well, you do realize that as a member of one of the world’s most vicious and oppressive ethnic majorities you clearly have, having things broke off in you, coming as divine application of equitable social justice.


  72. Nevergiveup
    74 | June 9, 2010 4:13 pm

    I haven’t eaten all day and i just had a beer. I feel pretty good.


  73. waldensianspirit
    75 | June 9, 2010 4:15 pm

    http://jammiewearingfool.blogspot.com/2010/06/this-is-definition-of-dirty-war.html

    I say we step back and apply a periodic carpet of daisy cutters to sanitize Afghanistan.


  74. 76 | June 9, 2010 4:16 pm

    Nevergiveup wrote:

    I haven’t eaten all day and i just had a beer. I feel pretty good.

    Which is clearly an indication of your racist and oppressive mentality, who did you have to oppress to obtain what was clearly someone else fair share of beer?


  75. Nevergiveup
    77 | June 9, 2010 4:17 pm

    doriangrey wrote:

    Nevergiveup wrote:

    I haven’t eaten all day and i just had a beer. I feel pretty good.

    Which is clearly an indication of your racist and oppressive mentality, who did you have to oppress to obtain what was clearly someone else fair share of beer?

    Some guy named Coors?


  76. snork
    78 | June 9, 2010 4:18 pm

    Nevergiveup wrote:

    Is he fuckin kidding?

    At least Clinton did one of those two.


  77. 79 | June 9, 2010 4:19 pm

    waldensianspirit wrote:

    http://jammiewearingfool.blogspot.com/2010/06/this-is-definition-of-dirty-war.html
    I say we step back and apply a periodic carpet of daisy cutters to sanitize Afghanistan.

    Daisey cutters are to small, MOAB’s would be a step in the right direction…


  78. 80 | June 9, 2010 4:20 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    I worked in Haifa for a construction company hired by the Bahai’s for the structural erection of their administative haedquarters expansion.

    Three years ’92-’94

    I am not a Bahai, but I read on their religion among others while there, and consider the circumstances that lead to my employment in Israel as Provident ansd an answer to childhood prayers.


  79. 81 | June 9, 2010 4:21 pm

    Nevergiveup wrote:

    doriangrey wrote:
    Nevergiveup wrote:
    I haven’t eaten all day and i just had a beer. I feel pretty good.
    Which is clearly an indication of your racist and oppressive mentality, who did you have to oppress to obtain what was clearly someone else fair share of beer?

    Some guy named Coors?

    Oh sheesh, not only are you oppressive, but you practice your oppression against the taste challenged/impaired…


  80. waldensianspirit
    82 | June 9, 2010 4:21 pm

    @ doriangrey:
    lol! Yea, that’s more like it. Take out the biohazards and the poppy fields all at once!


  81. buzzsawmonkey
    83 | June 9, 2010 4:22 pm

    This is kind of big: Involuntary Martyrs Finish Off Al Qaeda in Iraq

    The money quote:

    June 7, 2010: The U.S. recently reported that, in the last few months, American and Iraqi forces had killed or captured 34 of the 42 most senior al Qaeda leaders in Iraq. American intelligence has discovered that this huge loss has paralyzed al Qaeda in Iraq, which is now unable to find volunteers to replace all the lost leaders. The losses have also cut communications with other al Qaeda groups, especially the senior leadership in Pakistan. The large loss of leaders also led to an unprecedented capture of documents and al Qaeda leaders willing to talk. Many family members of these leaders were also willing to discuss their experiences. For example, the widow of slain (in April) al Qaeda in Iraq leader Abu Ayyub al-Masri revealed that she and her husband (they are both Egyptian) came to Iraq in 2002, having been offered sanctuary by Saddam Hussein. Many other al Qaeda were found to be terrorists hiding out in Iraq, under Saddam’s protection, and having nowhere to run after 2003.

    You will note from the above highlighted section that Saddam Hussein invited Al Qaeda in before the US invasion, contrary to the line that has been spun for years by the peacenik Left.


  82. 84 | June 9, 2010 4:22 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    Did you just say, “take it whitey, and you better like it”?


  83. citizen_q
    85 | June 9, 2010 4:23 pm

    @ doriangrey:
    @ waldensianspirit:
    Nuke ‘em from orbit. Its the only way to be sure.

    Someone had to say it.


  84. Nevergiveup
    86 | June 9, 2010 4:25 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Nevergiveup:

    I worked in Haifa for a construction company hired by the Bahai’s for the structural erection of their administative haedquarters expansion.

    Three years ‘92-’94

    I am not a Bahai, but I read on their religion among others while there, and consider the circumstances that lead to my employment in Israel as Provident ansd an answer to childhood prayers.

    Sounds like it was a nice gig. They always seemed nice when I took people there. I lived on a Kibbutz right outside of Acco one summer also, so I wasn’t to far from Haifa. But Haifa is actually a city that I mostly just passed thru on my way North.


  85. Nevergiveup
    87 | June 9, 2010 4:25 pm

    @ doriangrey:
    But I hear this guy Coors in on our side?


  86. 88 | June 9, 2010 4:26 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ doriangrey:
    Did you just say, “take it whitey, and you better like it”?

    Hey, just translating heralding the message of the Messiah of the Obamanation… :mrgreen:


  87. 89 | June 9, 2010 4:28 pm

    citizen_q wrote:

    Someone had to say it.

    <—- Whistles quietly while mumbling could have sworn I already said that…


  88. vagabond trader
    90 | June 9, 2010 4:29 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Well well,the progs will issue an apology on all 3 cable networks. I’m sure they will. Huh? Why are you laughing?


  89. 91 | June 9, 2010 4:30 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    I got to know the North like my own back yard. Rode tripped on a large frame mountain/touring bike extensively. I could have taken a five year contract after mt second year, and wanted to, but my mother was bit freaked so I was tossing it around in my head, and then came Oslo (I saw the writing on the wall with that folly), so I cut out before it got rough.


  90. citizen_q
    92 | June 9, 2010 4:30 pm

    @ doriangrey:
    Sorry about that —— Maxwell Smart agent 86


  91. Nevergiveup
    93 | June 9, 2010 4:33 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Nevergiveup:

    I got to know the North like my own back yard. Rode tripped on a large frame mountain/touring bike extensively. I could have taken a five year contract after mt second year, and wanted to, but my mother was bit freaked so I was tossing it around in my head, and then came Oslo (I saw the writing on the wall with that folly), so I cut out before it got rough.

    One of the best things I did was to be a volunteer Dentist on a Kibbutz right outside of Kiryat Shmona one summer--Kibbutz Hagoshrim. I had a great time. I didn’t even mind the shelling


  92. waldensianspirit
    94 | June 9, 2010 4:34 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    Reminds me of the job my uncle would give us cousins [arming us all with clubs] when he’d lift the feeders in the barnyard with a front-end loader. We’d tie our pant legs tight shut at the bottom because uncle knew what he was talkin’ about.


  93. Ma Sands
    95 | June 9, 2010 4:34 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Alright ! Thank you, buzz, for bringing that to my attention.


  94. 96 | June 9, 2010 4:36 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    I lived on a Kibbutz right outside of Acco one summer also,

    Anywhere near Karmiel, lovely spring feed valley out there past Kfar Yussef. I got kicked out of a preserve there by park rangers one night while camping with my bike


  95. citizen_q
    97 | June 9, 2010 4:37 pm

    @ waldensianspirit:

    Rats?

    Sorry, city boy here.


  96. Nevergiveup
    98 | June 9, 2010 4:38 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Nevergiveup:

    I lived on a Kibbutz right outside of Acco one summer also,

    Anywhere near Karmiel, lovely spring feed valley out there past Kfar Yussef. I got kicked out of a preserve there by park rangers one night while camping with my bike

    I was on Ein Hammefratz, which was just outside Acco to the south. A girl I knew grew up there and still had family there. All good times. All good times. And if you never got kicked out of anyplace, then ya just haven’t lived


  97. 99 | June 9, 2010 4:39 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    My Katyusha night happened outside of K. Shimona. I shot pistol at the Canadian American Sporting Center there once too. Jacobs Ladder bluegrass festival one year too.

    Damn, I want to be back. It was a privledge I’ll never forget


  98. waldensianspirit
    100 | June 9, 2010 4:40 pm

    @ citizen_q:
    Big mean fast beasts that looked like rats. We had to be fast and uncle would grumble[although he knew it was impossible] about how we’re too slow so we’ll have to do it again next month.


  99. citizen_q
    101 | June 9, 2010 4:43 pm

    @ waldensianspirit:

    Well don’t feel bad. I was just thinking of my brothers and I doing that chore. The scene in my head keeps morphing into a 3 Stooges Episode.


  100. 102 | June 9, 2010 4:43 pm

    Students of the Bible are aware that Christ told us when Israel was again a nation (the only extinct nation to come back into existence) then the generation that was living at that event would still be alive, or many of them, when God wraps up His current dealings with mankind with some well deserved judgments.

    Israel is being used by God to provoke the intrinsic evil and hatred of God within men to become fully displayed. It seems incredible to me that the entire world is focused on the tiny state of Israel and is in a constant uproar about Israel just trying to exist. It is self-evident that people cannot get to God, cannot see Him, nor vent their rage directly, so instead through history they have vented it first to the Jew and secondly to the Christian.

    But Christianity is not really identifiable as a nation, however the nation that is most identified as THE Christian nation is America, and after Israel is the most hated nation on earth. But primarily the servants of Satan attack and hate the Jews, and Israel. According to the Bible this was all expected and indeed a trap set by God to draw the evil to a place of judgment.

    With the events taking place, I would say it is a matter of just a few years, not decades before this all plays out. As for me I will pray for America and Israel, and have faith that the time for the judgment of the wicked has come, and they damn well deserve what is coming.


  101. 103 | June 9, 2010 4:45 pm

    Nevergiveup wrote:

    Hezbollah stands by disgraced US reporter Helen Thomas
    Published: 06.09.10, 21:09 / Israel News
    Hezbollah on Wednesday saluted veteran US reporter Helen Thomas’s “courage” for her controversial comments against Israel, which sparked a furor and forced her to retire.
    “Respected American journalist Helen Thomas’s answer shows … a courageous, bold, honest and free opinion which expresses what people across the globe believe: that Israel is a racist state of murderers and thugs,” Hezbollah MP Hussein Moussawi said in a statement. (AFP)
    They supported Obama in the last election also didn’t they?

    Unlike the U.S. Israel won’t let that racist bs claim stop her from defending herself. South Africa was called apartheid until they got their black President Mandela. Then they became apartheid with vengeance. murderous and full of chaos. Make no mistake.The same thing would happen in the United States should we be blessed with total black government. Slips of the tongues tip you off on that one.

    No surprise on Helen Thomas. All you have to do is hear all the past comments she has had. Like all the rest of the lurking evil,she believed Obama’s presidency made it safe to just come on out. The most telling of it all though.Was her admission of being of arab descent.Helen Thomas the ugly that seeped from inside out.(please do not accuse me of being racist for this post.)


  102. Nevergiveup
    104 | June 9, 2010 4:47 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    @ Nevergiveup:

    My Katyusha night happened outside of K. Shimona. I shot pistol at the Canadian American Sporting Center there once too. Jacobs Ladder bluegrass festival one year too.

    Damn, I want to be back. It was a privledge I’ll never forget

    I took my whole family there 10 years ago for my older daughters bat mitzvah and when we were up north we went ice skating in the middle of the summer at Canada House. When we were there a bunch of Etheopian Soldiers were there skating in their shorts. They were terrible but having a great time and my kids were having a great time trying to teach them. Talk about multi-cultural: White Jewish kids from NJ skating with Black Jewish Soldiers from Ethiopia.


  103. calcajun
    105 | June 9, 2010 4:47 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    You tend to ocelot of him.


  104. 106 | June 9, 2010 4:50 pm

    @ Nevergiveup:

    Yep, coast road passes through there, Bahai’s have one of there holy gardens near there and the Quoranic well of the cow is alleged to be somewhere nearby.

    When you go up the road and pass the Naval Academy entering Acre you would sometimes see Flotilla 13 training units bivvied out on the beach on the left there. They probably don’t do that now I imagine, too much exposure.

    a flood of memories


  105. Lost
    107 | June 9, 2010 4:53 pm

    Hi, all.

    Just a fly-by post.

    Got this by email and was wondering if its legitimate?

    http://jcrcny.org/flotilla/statedeptpetition.html


  106. 108 | June 9, 2010 4:56 pm

    @ Jehu:

    I have lived my life aware of this, and yes I have lost sleep over it.

    My wife doesn’t like it much when I bring it up to justify my mindset concerning security related purchases. She doesn’t “want to live like that”, so we still spend way to much in frivolities to keep hear sane and somewhat oblivious, though not as badly clueless as the average yuppie.


  107. Ma Sands
    109 | June 9, 2010 5:01 pm

    @ Jehu:

    Much alert wisdom in that, Jehu.
    But I have a question or two:
    When you say, “Students of the Bible are aware that Christ told us when Israel was again a nation (the only extinct nation to come back into existence) then the generation that was living at that event would still be alive, or many of them, when God wraps up His current dealings with mankind with some well deserved judgments.” …..I cannot recollect where it says in the Bible that I’d still be alive (I was born in early ’48) …..could you so kindly give me a reference?
    Then, about these words of yours. “…a trap set by God to draw the evil to a place of judgment.” …..I guess it’s not so much a question, as an observation of God’s ways: I think it is more of an eternal knowledge of all time, and of what people are made of, and of Satan’s works and role, rather than a trap…..


  108. Ma Sands
    110 | June 9, 2010 5:05 pm

    @ Scott Madsen:

    You think “security related purchases” are what is needed, or what will help? And, if so, to what end purpose? I get so curious when folks speak of that kind of preparation….. : )


  109. waldensianspirit
    111 | June 9, 2010 5:13 pm

    @ Ma Sands:
    Me? I’m prepping to head to the mountains


  110. buzzsawmonkey
    112 | June 9, 2010 5:16 pm

    Jehu wrote:

    when Israel was again a nation (the only extinct nation to come back into existence)

    So that’s why the Left hates Jews; we confound the theory of evolution.


  111. 113 | June 9, 2010 5:23 pm

    @ Ma Sands:

    I come from the land, I am only the second generation in my family to take to the cities (their suburbs) as a services worker. We missed that whole ethnic urban factory worker chip on the shoulder since we left feudal Europe on a steam ship thing by being happily pastoral for eight to ten generations as American’s.

    It is my opinion that the cities will burn due to the worst that is human nature. It is necessary for all of us to learn a collective lesson on what we are supposed to be here on God’s earth for.

    I simply don’t plan on being there for the brunt of it and would prefer to survive or have my children survive me to help stand up an Ever Advancing Civilization when the smoke clears.

    That means, I will till the land to survive, I have the land, the tools, will, family network and knowledge to succede, and if the time comes, I will kill the man or institutional agent off any neo feudalist system that inhibits that Ultimate
    Mission.


  112. Ma Sands
    114 | June 9, 2010 5:25 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Buzz, you are funny. : )


  113. 115 | June 9, 2010 5:29 pm

    @ Scott Madsen:

    Sorry to sound harsh, my life’s work as it is.


  114. Ma Sands
    116 | June 9, 2010 5:29 pm

    @ Scott Madsen:

    I see. I was able to find opportunity to ask the same question of no2liberals, a couple of weeks ago…..and he essentially gave the same answer --that you both expect the smoke to clear, and humans to go another round of a great length of time…..


  115. Silhouette
    117 | June 9, 2010 5:41 pm

    Scott Madsen wrote:

    since we left feudal Europe on a steam ship

    Steam ships? Pfffth. Newcomers. Mine all came by sail. Up hill, both ways!


  116. 118 | June 9, 2010 6:01 pm

    @ Silhouette:

    I meant they….typing in a frenzy.

    There is a deliniation there, it may be argued, but then again it may be taken as stereotyping. There have been many who have come since the advent of steam who have fully embraced being American and have stood theirselves up on their own, without ganging up and getting the government to run protection for their grievances agaist individuals beahvior while engaging in free commerce.

    It all comes down to how we treat one another, and our humility and self assesment using at the least the Noahide rules while so engaged.

    I really have an issue with what cynics and oppertunists have done with the ignorant clamoring masses of our once great industrial cities.

    Too damn bad so many never took what little liesure time they had to improve theirselves spiritually, but instead just nightly gripped on about their lot in life and downed another round at a club of their peers.


  117. 119 | June 9, 2010 6:02 pm

    Ma Sands wrote:

    I cannot recollect where it says in the Bible that I’d still be alive

    Um, that would be Luke 21:29-32

    21:29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;

    21:30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.

    21:31 So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.

    21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.


  118. Ma Sands
    120 | June 9, 2010 6:09 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    Ah, I see. Thank you, doriangrey. : )


  119. 121 | June 9, 2010 6:18 pm

    Silhouette wrote:

    Newcomers. Mine all came by sail. Up hill, both ways!

    Talk about newcomers, ya’ll are slackers too, Mine walked across a glacier to get here. (Well ok some of mine also came across in a sailing ship, back in the early 1600′s {damn whalers}) But my mom’s mother was a “X haplogroup Native American”


  120. 122 | June 9, 2010 6:27 pm

    Ma Sands wrote:

    @ doriangrey:
    Ah, I see. Thank you, doriangrey. : )

    I’m not sure it actually means that the individuals alive when Israel reformed will still be alive, another translation might be that the nation of Israel will still be a nation when the Christ returns.

    The interpretation of biblical prophecy is a very tricky thing. The one thing that a careful study of biblical prophecy revels regarding prophecy is that even those most dedicated to it’s study missed what they were earnestly looking for virtually every single time.

    Biblical prophecy always says exactly what is going to happen and how it’s going to happen, and yet even though when it comes to pass it is exactly the way it was written, somehow it is never what those reading it expect it to be.


  121. Ma Sands
    123 | June 9, 2010 6:39 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    That is a very wise piece of writing, dorian.

    P.S. Best I recall of yourself, is the time that the place you were living in California, was burning, a couple of years ago…….everything come out okay during that time?


  122. 124 | June 9, 2010 6:45 pm

    Well done!

    I’m very proud my father was Jewish. God bless Jews everywhere. Helen Thomas can kiss my ass.


  123. 125 | June 9, 2010 7:10 pm

    Ma Sands wrote:

    everything come out okay during that time?

    Well the flames eventually went out, the grass regrew, the tree’s that weren’t completely killed and burned up healed and put new leaves on, and by the grace of God nobody in my family’s home got burned down that time (Oct. 2007 Witch Creek Fire) . (in the previous wildfire, the Oct. 2003 Cedars fire, one of my brothers and his wife’s sister both lost their houses) Life goes on and for what time the lord blesses me with so do I…


  124. Ma Sands
    126 | June 9, 2010 9:51 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    Thank you for the update; I have always wondered. : )


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