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What Death Panels? Cancer tests to be cut back!

by Rodan ( 162 Comments › )
Filed under Barack Obama, Democratic Party, Economy, Health Care, Progressives, Special Report at April 5th, 2012 - 8:00 am

Progressives cried foul when Sarah Palin said Obamcare would lead to death panels. They attacked and smeared any Conservative who pointed out that once the government gets involved in healthcare and expands coverage, they would then have to ration it. Well the rationing has begun. The American Society of Clinical Oncology has recommended 5 cancer tests that should not be given. They claim it hurts the patients, but clearly this was done to reduce the amount of care given.

NEW YORK (Reuters) – In a move that threatens to further inflame concerns about the rationing of medical care, the nation’s leading association of cancer physicians issued a list on Wednesday of five common tests and treatments that doctors should stop offering to cancer patients.

The list emerged from a two-year effort, similar to a project other medical specialties are undertaking, to identify procedures that do not help patients live longer or better or that may even be harmful, yet are routinely prescribed.

As much as 30 percent of health-care spending goes to procedures, tests, and hospital stays that do not improve a patient’s health, according to a 2008 analysis by the nonpartisan Congressional Budget office.

“Our goal was to improve care and improve the value of the care we deliver,” said Dr. Lowell Schnipper, a cancer physician at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center who led the task force assembled by the American Society of Clinical Oncology (ASCO). The group of more than 200 oncologists released the list from a report in its Journal of Clinical Oncology.

[....]

Following the science, however, can lead to conclusions that do not sit well with all patients. Shari Baker, who was diagnosed with metastatic breast cancer eight years ago and has been in remission since 2007, has already felt the brunt of one of the recommendations: that patients who have been successfully treated for breast cancer and have no symptoms of cancer not undergo CT, PET, other imaging, or bone scans to check for a recurrence or spread of the disease, known as metastasis.

“As a survivor of bone metastasis — the breast cancer had spread to my spine — after my doctor told me I was clear those PET scans were my peace of mind,” said Baker, a jewelry designer in Scottsdale, Ariz. “By the time you have symptoms it’s too late.”

Her insurer, guided by the same kind of studies that served as the basis for the ASCO list, would not cover the scan, citing that it provides no benefit.

This is rationing pure and simple. The Progressives can lie all they want, but the truth is with government demands to reduce costs, it will be the patients who bear the burden. Pray the Supreme Court throws out Obamcare. Our lives literally depend on it!

(Hat Tip: Brookly Red)

 

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162 Responses to “What Death Panels? Cancer tests to be cut back!”
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  1. Bumr50
    1 | April 5, 2012 8:04 am

    I’m not always the biggest fan of Sarah Palin, mainly because of her overuse of cliches, but MASSIVE kudos to her for having the balls to put this term out there at a time when most people thought her a complete idiot.


  2. MikeA
    2 | April 5, 2012 8:15 am

    Ask most people who have lived in universal care countries and they will agree that the care is rationed. It has to be when implementing this type of system. No one wants to say it but don’t worry, I am sure the president and Congress will have the same health care we have….


  3. 3 | April 5, 2012 8:22 am

    Hey Rodan, look a the OOT from this morning, I put a link on there about Hispanics not wanting to be called Hispanics. I thought you might like to do a headline on it…..

    Carry on.


  4. citizen_q
    4 | April 5, 2012 8:56 am

    The subterfuge of calling obamacare the Affordable Health Care Act is Orwellian Newspeak to fool the unthinking and ill informed. How wonderful! Affordable health care for all! It’s a chimera only upheld by rationing, with the sweetener for those in power of deciding whom get it.

    obama and his ilk are setting themselves up as gods deciding, the value of our existence, who lives, who dies, and under what conditions.

    Pure totalitarian evil.


  5. 5 | April 5, 2012 9:09 am

    @ MacDuff:

    There’s alot of truth to that. When we use the Term Hispanic(Hispano) we mean it in a cultural sense like how Irish or Scots call themselves Celts. But like Irish and Scots, we tend to identify with our nation of origins. In my case I’m Spaniard/Lebanese-Dominican/Puerto Rican/Sicilian. Hispanic has been turned into some politically created race both Democrats and Republicans use for political ping pong.

    Getting back on topic, This rationing stuff scares me. My Dad is 65, My Step dad is 66 and My mom is turning 60. This is not siome abstract stuff. This will effect all of us.


  6. 6 | April 5, 2012 9:14 am

    @ Bumr50:

    She was right on this one.


  7. 7 | April 5, 2012 9:14 am

    @ citizen_q:

    It will be death panels and then eventually eugenics.


  8. Bumr50
    8 | April 5, 2012 9:20 am

    @ Rodan:

    I’m convinced that the hardcore globalists have a definite number of people that comprise a “sustainable population.”


  9. 9 | April 5, 2012 9:22 am

    Saw this story today here in Ontario Candada. Up here any test and procedure takes forever. You need a CAT scan? think months instead of days. You need a family doctor? Depending on where you are it could take months to years to find one that is taking on new patients. As well, all medications are out of pocket expenses NOT covered by health care. Thank god we aren’t as bad off as Britain and their NHS issues.


  10. 10 | April 5, 2012 9:24 am

    Simply put, free market capitalism has raised the quality, decreased the cost and widened the availability of everything it has touched. Everything, with no exceptions. Government has fouled the pharmaceutical industry, the health care industry and the medical technology industry by regulating the profit motive out of each of them and these same interlopers, incredulously, stand before us and say “we’ll make this our purview and we’ll reduce costs and increase availability”. To those who peddle this balderdash, I would like one, just one example of government succeeding where free market capitalism has failed.

    I rest my case.


  11. 11 | April 5, 2012 9:25 am

    And we get to find out more about what’s in it. These people must be stopped at any cost, even if it means putting Romney in the White House.


  12. 12 | April 5, 2012 9:27 am

    @ Bumr50:

    Bill Ayers said they have to kill 25 Million Americans. Pol Pot’s Cambodia was the blueprint.


  13. 13 | April 5, 2012 9:28 am

    @ Flyovercountry:

    This is one of the main reasons to vote out Obama. This is a question of life or death.


  14. 14 | April 5, 2012 9:29 am

    @ MacDuff:
    I agree. The amount of MRI machines up here is pitiful in comparison to a typical American state. As well, they aren’t run to full capacity for some reason. New tech and medicines take forever to get approved as well.


  15. Bumr50
    15 | April 5, 2012 9:31 am

    @ Rodan:

    I heard that, but assumed that was more for the purposes of eliminating opposition rather than creating a sustainable number of people.

    Their ends (eliminating people) are the same but represent two different schools of thought.

    Ayers and Co. estimated that was the number of people that refused to surrender their individualism to the point that they’d pose a threat to whatever Statist hybrid system they intend to implement in place of the US Constitution.


  16. citizen_q
    16 | April 5, 2012 9:33 am

    Flyovercountry wrote:

    And we get to find out more about what’s in it. These people must be stopped at any cost, even if it means putting Romney in the White House.

    True. I wonder if Romney is deluded enough to think that most support he garners if he wins the nomination will be something other than tepid anyone but obama sentiment.


  17. Bumr50
    17 | April 5, 2012 9:33 am

    PaladinPhil wrote:

    As well, they aren’t run to full capacity for some reason.

    Money.


  18. waldensianspirit
    18 | April 5, 2012 9:33 am

    If electronic equipment was all manufactured by the government the cost would be so high cell phones would have to be rationed. Yet our not-so-bright portion of the population who cry for universal” health care cannot see they can all afford cell phones because they come from a much more effective system than big government. Free market competitiveness with a society driven to excel in technology would create better and better health care for all.


  19. citizen_q
    19 | April 5, 2012 9:35 am

    @ Rodan:
    Wasn’t that estimate based on 1970′s population levels?

    I am sure ayers would not be satisfied with such a paltry number now.


  20. 20 | April 5, 2012 9:36 am

    @ citizen_q:

    He probably would want 75 Million killed now.


  21. 21 | April 5, 2012 9:37 am

    @ Rodan:

    One of the reasons I went ahead with my surgery when I did was the simple fear that if I continued as I was sooner or later my health care would be cut off by the government. It was the right decision to make for a whole host of reasons, but fear of the future was one of the things that made me pull the trigger when I did.


  22. 22 | April 5, 2012 9:38 am

    @ Bumr50:

    This was Obama’s mentor.


  23. Bumr50
    23 | April 5, 2012 9:38 am

    @ citizen_q:

    He just brought on Ed Gillespie, ex- W. Bush advisor and Karl Rove consort at American Crossroads as a high-level campaign manager.

    Nothing about Romney encourages me, but we’re going to have to try like hell to get his sorry butt into office.

    It’s beyond frustrating.


  24. 24 | April 5, 2012 9:41 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    You did the right thing and I advise everyone to get any surgery out of the way.


  25. citizen_q
    25 | April 5, 2012 9:42 am

    O/T

    Sinai has become a “terror zone”

    Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu Thursday vowed to strike at those who attack Israel and said the Jewish state can never stop fighting terrorism, speaking hours after a Grad rocket fired from the Sinai Peninsula exploded in Eilat.

    While we are talking with the mo-bro-hoods.


  26. 26 | April 5, 2012 9:42 am

    PaladinPhil wrote:

    @ MacDuff:
    I agree. The amount of MRI machines up here is pitiful in comparison to a typical American state. As well, they aren’t run to full capacity for some reason. New tech and medicines take forever to get approved as well.

    A few years ago the licensing authority in KY was debating how many hospitals in Louisville could be licensed to have a MRI. Understand that Louisville has long been a major center for healthcare companies and we seem to have a hospital on every block. Why would the state want to limit the availability of MRIs?


  27. citizen_q
    27 | April 5, 2012 9:44 am

    @ Bumr50:
    I hear ya!


  28. 28 | April 5, 2012 9:45 am

    I come from a medical family (I’m in law because the sight of blood doesn’t work for me and I watched way too much Perry Mason growing up).

    The AMA may support Obamacare, but doctors do not. They foresee the restrictions on testing, diagnotic procedures and treatment as massive malpractice suits waiting to happen. And they point out that Obamacare (at least as far as they’ve seen) offers no shelter from slip and fall lawyers like John Edwards lining up to sue them.


  29. Guggi
    29 | April 5, 2012 9:45 am

    Instead of expensive tests you could use dogs to sniffle for cancer ?


  30. 30 | April 5, 2012 9:45 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ citizen_q:

    He probably would want 75 Million killed now.

    Hmm, that’s just about the number of Baby Boomers left……….


  31. citizen_q
    31 | April 5, 2012 9:47 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    @ Rodan:
    I have carpal tunnel on both hands. A side effect of a long career as a systems admin. No permanent damage yet, but it is painful and limits certain activities. I have been putting off surgery. There is a 4 to 5 week recovery period where I would not be able to work.

    One big factor as I mull this over is wondering if I will be able to get the surgery when I need it. My carpal tunnel is progressing slowly. I am pretty sure i will need it at some point, the question is when.


  32. waldensianspirit
    32 | April 5, 2012 9:49 am

    MacDuff wrote:

    Why would the state want to limit the availability of MRIs?

    They have a big, big, big carbon footprint?


  33. Bumr50
    33 | April 5, 2012 9:51 am

    @ waldensianspirit:

    It’s almost definitely cost-related.

    Probably labor.


  34. 34 | April 5, 2012 9:52 am

    @ citizen_q:

    Yet Obama and McCain love these clowns.


  35. citizen_q
    35 | April 5, 2012 9:53 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    The AMA may support Obamacare, but doctors do not.

    Been wondering if the AMA is to doctors as AARP is to the elderly.


  36. 36 | April 5, 2012 9:53 am

    @ MacDuff:

    This is Eugenics we are seeing. Progressives have wanted this for 100 years.


  37. 37 | April 5, 2012 9:54 am

    @ citizen_q:

    One of the goals of Obamacare is to replace American doctors with Pakistani and other Islamic ones.


  38. citizen_q
    38 | April 5, 2012 9:54 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ citizen_q:
    Yet Obama and McCain love these clowns.

    The lover of my enemies is my enemy.


  39. 39 | April 5, 2012 9:55 am

    @ citizen_q:

    Yup. Obama and McCain will have the blood of Egyptian Copts on their hands.


  40. 40 | April 5, 2012 9:56 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    And no tort reform will be happening as long as the Democrats are in control. They are a wholly owned subsidiary of the Trial LAwyers association. If you had tort reform and allowed medical insurance to be sold across state lines, you’d be a long way to really fixing the problems with our medical system , and the Democrats don’t want that to happen. They view this as a crisis not to waste, but to expand the power of government to the maximum extent possible. They want to have control of who lives and who dies. Then they can ration treatment based on political reliability.


  41. 41 | April 5, 2012 10:00 am

    @ citizen_q:

    It is. Same as the ABA is to lawyers. Most lawyers do not belong to the ABA (I work for four, and NONE of them belong), and most doctors do not belong to the AMA.


  42. 42 | April 5, 2012 10:00 am

    I quit smoking (cigarettes) 15 months ago and am trying to be a bit more health conscious. figure sticking around is the best revenge.

    In the words of Papillon, “I’m still here, ya bastards!”


  43. citizen_q
    43 | April 5, 2012 10:01 am

    @ Rodan:
    Yes they do, and in the Sudan and elsewhere. They seem to be non-people in their eyes and the MFM given the silence. mslsd edited the 911 tape to gin up racial hatred in the trevon martin case, but there is silence on muslim bigotry, murder, and ethnic cleansing.


  44. 44 | April 5, 2012 10:03 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    No one ever mention that the real reason health care is so damn expensive is the exorbitant insurance premiums being paid by individual doctors and hospitals for malpractice insurance. Anesthesiologists are the worst hit, having to pay premiums of $100,000 a year or more. And a lot of the premiums aren’t based on an individual doctor’s medical performance history -- they’re based on the specialty of their practice.


  45. 45 | April 5, 2012 10:05 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:

    No one ever mention that the real reason health care is so damn expensive is the exorbitant insurance premiums being paid by individual doctors and hospitals for malpractice insurance. Anesthesiologists are the worst hit, having to pay premiums of $100,000 a year or more. And a lot of the premiums aren’t based on an individual doctor’s medical performance history – they’re based on the specialty of their practice.

    Yeah, tort reform has to be part of the process. People should have legal redress, but it’s way out of control.


  46. 46 | April 5, 2012 10:06 am

    Bammy’s at -18 today, same as yesterday. Believe it or not, 14% rate the economy as “good” or “excellent.” Which begs the question -- what the hell color is the SKY where they live???


  47. waldensianspirit
    47 | April 5, 2012 10:08 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    what the hell color is the SKY where they live???

    Bet it’s pretty psychedelic!


  48. 48 | April 5, 2012 10:08 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    They are the people who work fo rthe Government, with these gilt-edged retirement plans we all know are going to go bankrupt in ten years or so. They don’t look to the future because the present is so cushy for them. They are going to get a nasty surprise when all that shit goes tits-up in a decade or so.


  49. 49 | April 5, 2012 10:09 am

    @ citizen_q:
    @ MacDuff:
    @ Carolina Girl:
    @ Iron Fist:

    The Arab Spring strikes again!


  50. 50 | April 5, 2012 10:09 am

    @ MacDuff:

    I couldn’t agree more. Anesthesiologist cousin told me of a fellow anesthesiologist who was sued because a woman died on the table for aspirating vomit. She had been told NOT to eat after midnight, told the doctors that she didn’t eat after midnight, lying about a McDonald’s breakfast she had on the way to the hospital. Jury awarded $15,000,000 for “negligence” on the part of the anesthesiologist -- their reasoning? They should have checked her into a hospital if they wanted to make sure she didn’t eat. No mention of individual responsibility or taking up a hospital bed for outpatient surgery.

    Why should the jury care; after all,it’s not their money.


  51. 51 | April 5, 2012 10:10 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    They believe anything their Pharaoh and the his Theban Priests tell them. It’s a cult.


  52. 52 | April 5, 2012 10:16 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Bammy’s at -18 today, same as yesterday. Believe it or not, 14% rate the economy as “good” or “excellent.” Which begs the question – what the hell color is the SKY where they live???

    How the hell would they know, what with their heads for far up their asses and all…


  53. buzzsawmonkey
    53 | April 5, 2012 10:16 am

    citizen_q wrote:

    The subterfuge of calling obamacare the Affordable Health Care Act is Orwellian Newspeak to fool the unthinking and ill informed.

    A “ford” is a shallow place where one wades across a stream.

    A Ford of Bull™ Health Care is having wade through a stream of bullshit to get health care.


  54. 54 | April 5, 2012 10:17 am

    @ doriangrey:

    And I don’t think Obamacare covers a cranial-rectal extraction.


  55. citizen_q
    55 | April 5, 2012 10:17 am

    @ Rodan:
    They are just celebrating Moses leading the muslims out of egypt. /


  56. 56 | April 5, 2012 10:20 am

    @ citizen_q:

    Yes, they were setting off fireworks!


  57. 57 | April 5, 2012 10:20 am

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Check the latest headline.


  58. 58 | April 5, 2012 10:30 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ MacDuff:

    I couldn’t agree more. Anesthesiologist cousin told me of a fellow anesthesiologist who was sued because a woman died on the table for aspirating vomit. She had been told NOT to eat after midnight, told the doctors that she didn’t eat after midnight, lying about a McDonald’s breakfast she had on the way to the hospital. Jury awarded $15,000,000 for “negligence” on the part of the anesthesiologist – their reasoning? They should have checked her into a hospital if they wanted to make sure she didn’t eat. No mention of individual responsibility or taking up a hospital bed for outpatient surgery.

    Why should the jury care; after all,it’s not their money.

    Years ago I had emergency surgery after a night of pizza and beer; clearly a very bad situation going in, even though they were fully aware of the situation. They damned near killed me. On top of my condition, I am also what they call a “difficult intubation”. I was awake during most of the horror. The fact that I’m even alive is testament to the skill of the anesthesiologist and the surgeon. The anesthesiologist was there when I awakened the next morning, sitting on my bed. She patted me on the knee and the first words out of her mouth were “I’m really glad to see you”.

    I’ve a raft of “conditions”now, keep track of meds on a spreadsheet and I have to say that always impressed with the health care system we have. Yeah, there are exceptions, but I don’t think the litigation, and threatened litigation rate is NOT representative of the profession. Not even close.


  59. Bumr50
    59 | April 5, 2012 10:31 am

    LMAO!

    Constitutional law scholar Laurence Tribe, a Harvard Law School professor and former mentor to President Barack Obama, said the president “obviously misspoke” earlier this week when he made comments about the Supreme Court possibly overturning the health-care law.

    Mr. Tribe, who calls the president was one of his best students, said in an interview: “He didn’t say what he meant…and having said that, in order to avoid misleading anyone, he had to clarify it.”


  60. 60 | April 5, 2012 10:36 am

    @ Bumr50:

    He didn’t misspeak.


  61. Guggi
    61 | April 5, 2012 10:37 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    No one ever mention that the real reason health care is so damn expensive is the exorbitant insurance premiums being paid by individual doctors and hospitals for malpractice insurance. Anesthesiologists are the worst hit, having to pay premiums of $100,000 a year or more. And a lot of the premiums aren’t based on an individual doctor’s medical performance history – they’re based on the specialty of their practice.

    I understand this but how do you explain the high costs in Europe and we do not have those malpractice insurance problems ?


  62. 62 | April 5, 2012 10:39 am

    Bumr50 wrote:

    “He didn’t say what he meant…and having said that, in order to avoid misleading anyone, he had to clarify it.”

    Man, that sentence is so slippery you could use it as industrial lubrication! Geez.


  63. buzzsawmonkey
    63 | April 5, 2012 10:39 am

    Rodan wrote:

    Check the latest headline.

    The one expanding on Gunter Grass’s past, or the one which mentions the Egyptians are slinging crap at Eilat?


  64. 64 | April 5, 2012 10:41 am

    Guggi wrote:

    I understand this but how do you explain the high costs in Europe and we do not have those malpractice insurance problems ?

    Government involvement.


  65. Bumr50
    65 | April 5, 2012 10:41 am

    @ MacDuff:

    If I were in his class, I’d tank a couple of questions on an exam, then schedule a meeting explaining about how I “mismarked.”


  66. buzzsawmonkey
    66 | April 5, 2012 10:42 am

    @ Guggi:
    @ MacDuff:

    Anything done for the government costs twice as much for half the quality and takes three times as long.

    Anything.


  67. 67 | April 5, 2012 10:44 am

    @ Rodan:

    Damn right he didn’t. You don’t make “mistakes” like that. I knowmore Constitutional Law than that. He didn’t think he’d get called on his bullshit. I bet it shocked the shit out of him when he actually got called on it. He didn’t expect to have to walk it back, and he sure didn’t expect the 5th Circuit to demand homework from the JustUs Department on it. I think that is marvelous! Maybe his semi-divine godhood is starting to wear thin on some people.


  68. Guggi
    68 | April 5, 2012 10:49 am

    @ MacDuff:
    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Do government doesn’t do healthcare in most European countries (beside GB). They make the laws but the health insurances are mostly co-ops or unions.


  69. 69 | April 5, 2012 10:50 am

    @ Bumr50:

    I don’t believe for one minute that he misspoke. In fact, even his research was faulty. Lochner was a case involving state law, and as recent as 1995 and 2002, the Supreme Court has struck down “duly constituted” laws passed by Congress regarding the Commerce Clause, stating that Congress had “overstepped its bounds.”

    And I don’t believe one another minute that Tribe even REMEMBERS Barack Obama as a student.


  70. 70 | April 5, 2012 10:52 am

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    The one which mentions the rocket fire at Eilat?


  71. 71 | April 5, 2012 10:52 am

    @ MacDuff:

    In California, in order to sustain a malpractice suit, you need to have two doctors sign off that the quality of care was substandard. Needless to say, we now have doctors who have made an industry out of signing off on worthless malpractice suits and are used as expert witnesses on behalf of the plaintiffs.


  72. 72 | April 5, 2012 10:52 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Nope he used to getting away with what he wants. When he gets pushed back, he doesn’t know what to do.


  73. 73 | April 5, 2012 10:56 am

    Were there large numbers of sick people in this country roaming the streets because hospitals told hem to screw themselves when presented for treatment? Yeah, they use the figure of “30 million uninsured” but I find it doubtful that number is as deadfall as it seems. “Uninsured” and “untreated” are entirely different things.

    I suspect that the actual problem was grossly oversold. it’s like we looked at a patient with kidney stones and decided to treat him with a multiple organ transplant and a six month course of chemotherapy.


  74. 74 | April 5, 2012 10:58 am

    @ MacDuff:

    deadfall=dreadful


  75. RIX
    75 | April 5, 2012 11:00 am

    Good morning. Sarah Palin had to be mocked & otherwise
    Alynskied for her Death Panel comment
    An inconvenient truth.
    Why should this be a surprise from Obama,a man who
    supported infanticide as a state senator to honor
    the womans original intent?


  76. 76 | April 5, 2012 11:01 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ MacDuff:

    In California, in order to sustain a malpractice suit, you need to have two doctors sign off that the quality of care was substandard. Needless to say, we now have doctors who have made an industry out of signing off on worthless malpractice suits and are used as expert witnesses on behalf of the plaintiffs.

    ROTFLMAO

    And a new profession has been born. Age 53 Occupation, professional medical prosecution expert witness. Number of patients zero. Number of Doctors successfully chased from California, hundreds.

    The good news for California is that people are currently able to drive to Arizona, Nevada, Oregon, for their medical needs. They have to purchase their electricity from other states now that they have made producing electricity in California damn near impossible. The bad new of course is that once everyone is forced to purchase an electric car, no one will be able to successfully drive as far as the state line.


  77. 77 | April 5, 2012 11:03 am

    @ MacDuff:

    It was a made up crisis. This is what Progressives do.


  78. 78 | April 5, 2012 11:05 am

    @ Rodan:

    And therein lies a path to victory this fall, if Romney will use it. Push back, and push back hard. Put Obama on the defensive, and his weaknesses will be on display to the world. Romney can do this. Whether he will do it is the real question.


  79. 79 | April 5, 2012 11:06 am

    @ RIX:

    Top o’ da mornin’, RIX!


  80. 80 | April 5, 2012 11:07 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Bumr50:
    I don’t believe for one minute that he misspoke. In fact, even his research was faulty. Lochner was a case involving state law, and as recent as 1995 and 2002, the Supreme Court has struck down “duly constituted” laws passed by Congress regarding the Commerce Clause, stating that Congress had “overstepped its bounds.”
    And I don’t believe one another minute that Tribe even REMEMBERS Barack Obama as a student.

    I wonder if Tribe remember Supreme Court Justices John Roberts or Elena Kagan?


  81. RIX
    81 | April 5, 2012 11:09 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ MacDuff:
    It was a made up crisis. This is what Progressives do.

    That is what they do. They are Sophists who exploit a
    crisis, manufacture the crisis, or flat make it up.
    They then domonize someone else and claim that they
    have the solution.
    To them the truth is just a nusiance & doesn’t get in
    the way.


  82. RIX
    82 | April 5, 2012 11:10 am

    MacDuff wrote:

    @ RIX:
    Top o’ da mornin’, RIX!

    Right back at ya Mac!


  83. huckfunn
    83 | April 5, 2012 11:11 am

    UK surgery bans elderly patient over her carbon footprint. Coming soon to a death panel near you.


  84. 84 | April 5, 2012 11:13 am

    @ doriangrey:

    Kagan is very memorable. I mean, how many angry bull dykes go through Harvard Law School… 8O


  85. 85 | April 5, 2012 11:13 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    What have I been saying. If you go after Obama personally, his nasty side comes out. He then stops being the Pharaoh and just becomes a politician. Once that occurs, he can be hammered on policy.


  86. 86 | April 5, 2012 11:14 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ doriangrey:

    Kagan is very memorable. I mean, how many angry bull dykes go through Harvard Law School…

    Well played!


  87. 87 | April 5, 2012 11:18 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ doriangrey:
    Kagan is very memorable. I mean, how many angry bull dykes go through Harvard Law School…

    Have you ever visited the Harvard campus? I did once, back in 1988 I believe. Harvard definitely had a pretty serious dyke and fairy infestation back then, I doubt that that has changed for the better since then. :shock:


  88. 88 | April 5, 2012 11:18 am

    @ huckfunn:

    They will use that as an excuse in the future.


  89. 89 | April 5, 2012 11:21 am

    @ doriangrey:

    They are part of the ruling elite.


  90. buzzsawmonkey
    90 | April 5, 2012 11:24 am

    Regarding Kagan, let us not forget that the First DA/DT Justice™ was the Dean of the Harvard Law School for a while—so Tribe doubtless remembers her.

    If for nothing else, she is memorable for banning military recruitment on the Harvard Law campus “because of the military’s anti-gay policy”—while conveniently forgetting that this “military policy” was imposed upon the military by the federal government at the urging of an Administration of which she was an active part.

    For that reason alone, she should never have been confirmed to the Court.


  91. huckfunn
    91 | April 5, 2012 11:26 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ huckfunn:

    They will use that as an excuse in the future.

    Absolutely. Now that the EPA can regulate everyone’s carbon emissions there will be charts that can show anyone’s carbon foot print, versus their age, versus how much a given procedure will cost. If the actuarial carbon char shows that Grandma has big feet, she’s done.


  92. 92 | April 5, 2012 11:28 am

    @ huckfunn:

    Yup, they will use this to eliminate undesirables. Hmm, I wonder where this all occurred before?

    Hint: Nazi Germany, Stalinist Russia, Maoist China and Pol Pot’s Cambodia.


  93. RIX
    93 | April 5, 2012 11:29 am

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    In your opinion , should kagan have recused herself
    on the ObamaCare case?


  94. lobo91
    94 | April 5, 2012 11:30 am

    @ MacDuff:

    “Uninsured” and “untreated” are entirely different things.

    And a lot of people on Medicaid (as well as some on Medicare) can tell you, “insured” and “treated” are also entirely different things.


  95. huckfunn
    95 | April 5, 2012 11:30 am

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    For that reason alone, she should never have been confirmed to the Court.

    Not only that, she’s dumb as a stump. Here’s her comment in court the other day; Obamacare is essentially “a gift of a boatload of money from the guv’mint to the hoy paloy”. Good grief!


  96. buzzsawmonkey
    96 | April 5, 2012 11:32 am

    RIX wrote:

    In your opinion , should kagan have recused herself
    on the ObamaCare case?

    Of course. And you will recall that when she recused herself from some relatively unimportant matter late last year, I pointed out that this was clearly intended as a “pre-emptive recusal”: “See? I’m recusing myself because I know it’s necessary to do so in this instance—so, since I clearly know when recusal is proper, do not dare to say a word to me when I don’t recuse myself for the Obamacare hearings!”

    Talk about transparency; her behavior and motives were utterly transparent. Corrupt and self-serving as hell, but utterly transparent.


  97. 97 | April 5, 2012 11:33 am

    @ lobo91:

    The Doctors hate Medicaid.


  98. 98 | April 5, 2012 11:34 am

    New Thread!


  99. buzzsawmonkey
    99 | April 5, 2012 11:35 am

    Kagan was put on the Court for two primary reasons; to shill for Obamacare and to shill for same-sex marriage. It was because of the latter that her own living arrangements, and her extremely personal interest in gay-rights issues, was not discussed during her confirmation hearing save in the most roundabout way. That is why I call her the DA/DT Justice; not merely because of her inappropriate stand on military recruitment over DA/DT, but because she was smuggled into the Court under the very DA/DT protocols she so despised as a law school dean.


  100. 100 | April 5, 2012 11:37 am

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Kagan was put on the Court for two primary reasons; to shill for Obamacare and to shill for same-sex marriage

    Yup!


  101. Alberta Oil Peon
    101 | April 5, 2012 11:37 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    I’m thinking plenty.


  102. RIX
    102 | April 5, 2012 11:46 am

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Of course. And you will recall that when she recused herself from some relatively unimportant matter late last year, I pointed out that this was clearly intended as a “pre-emptive recusal”: “See? I’m recusing myself because I know it’s necessary to do so in this instance—so, since I clearly know when recusal is proper, do not dare to say a word to me when I don’t recuse myself for the Obamacare hearings!”

    Yup,I recall that & I thought the same thing at the
    time.
    Now Carney is saying that “obviously” the President
    recognizes the Court authority to rule on the
    constitutionality of bills passed by Congress.
    Obviously?


  103. 103 | April 5, 2012 11:52 am

    RIX wrote:

    Now Carney is saying that “obviously” the President
    recognizes the Court authority to rule on the
    constitutionality of bills passed by Congress.
    Obviously?

    No doubt that has something to do with the Fifth Circuit Court ordering Eric Holder to produce a three page single spaced essay documenting the Courts legitimate authority to rule on the constitutionality of bills passed by Congress. Nothing like getting Benchslapped by the Courts themselves.


  104. RIX
    104 | April 5, 2012 11:58 am

    @ doriangrey:

    No doubt that has something to do with the Fifth Circuit Court ordering Eric Holder to produce a three page single spaced essay documenting the Courts legitimate authority to rule on the constitutionality of bills passed by Congress.

    I am surprised that they are complying.
    I think that it doesn’t have to do with fear
    of being held in contempt, but damage repair.
    “See, we respect the courts.”


  105. 105 | April 5, 2012 12:02 pm

    @ RIX:

    They don’t want to go too far down the path of disrespecting the Court. They don’t want Roe v. Wade treated badly by the next Republican President. You have to remember that Infanticide abortion is the Leftists crown jewel. Anything that threatens abortion is anathema, so the Court will be treated with a minimum of respect just to preserve that decision. NOw if the Court were to overturn Roe, you would see the Left go apeshit…


  106. 106 | April 5, 2012 12:20 pm

    RIX wrote:

    @ doriangrey:
    No doubt that has something to do with the Fifth Circuit Court ordering Eric Holder to produce a three page single spaced essay documenting the Courts legitimate authority to rule on the constitutionality of bills passed by Congress.
    I am surprised that they are complying.
    I think that it doesn’t have to do with fear
    of being held in contempt, but damage repair.
    “See, we respect the courts.”

    I’m thinking more like bunker mentality, with the way the Courts have been benchslapping the Obamanation administration of late.


  107. buzzsawmonkey
    107 | April 5, 2012 12:31 pm

    Consider each Administration utterance regarding the courts to be a progressive act of undermining: overreaching statement, mild backtrack, followed by the same again and again.

    The objective is to ultimately undermine respect for the courts by the time the Supreme Court outs with its Obamacare decision; if the Administration, aided by its media shills, has done its job according to the proper schedule, there will be a chorus of approval from the media and the mob when Obama refuses to recognize the Court’s decision.

    The Court would be well advised to issue its opinion—currently scheduled for some time in June—by the end of April, if it can. If it did so, it would confound the Administration’s schedule of undermining utterances.


  108. RIX
    108 | April 5, 2012 12:32 pm

    @ doriangrey:
    The Media keeps refering to BHO as a former Constitutional
    Law Prof.
    He was a part time lecturer at the University
    of Chicago, not Prof
    I wonder what his principal source of income was?


  109. RIX
    109 | April 5, 2012 12:35 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    The Court would be well advised to issue its opinion—currently scheduled for some time in June—by the end of April, if it can. If it did so, it would confound the Administration’s schedule of undermining utterances

    That would be smart. But I think that Kagan is probably
    a mole & would give the White House a heads up.
    They can get their shock troops in to the streets
    pretty quickly


  110. RIX
    110 | April 5, 2012 12:37 pm

    @ Iron Fist:
    Abortion is their sacrament. BHO even defended really late
    term, actually after birth.


  111. buzzsawmonkey
    111 | April 5, 2012 12:39 pm

    RIX wrote:

    I think that Kagan is probably
    a mole & would give the White House a heads up.
    They can get their shock troops in to the streets
    pretty quickly

    Both true. However, it takes a certain time to build up both media and popular sentiment—and if the proper groundwork has been laid, there may be an outpouring of noise, but it does not last.

    Even were Kagan to rat out the Court and the Administration to gin up its schlock troops, the foundation would not be there; it would be a flash in the pan. The Court would be de-fanging the Administration and showing its own contempt for this most lawless of regimes if it issued its opinion earlier than expected.


  112. 112 | April 5, 2012 12:45 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    I wish the cCourt would follow your advice. I think they’ve already decided against ObamaCare, and Kafgan went to Obama and snitched on the Court. I’m sure the Supreme Court Justices like snitches as much as everyone else loves them. But, anyway, I think that is what provoked Obama’s rather unwise statement. Getting th eOpinion out there by the end of the month would certainly make a statement, and confound the Court’s enemies, but I don’t think the Supreme Court is that political. They probably should be, but I don’t think they are. Besides, you know the opposition will drag out releasing their opinion just to give Obama the time to gin up the kind of uproar you are talking about. There’s no way Roberts will dis the opposing justices that way, though we all know if the situation were reversed the Leftists on the Court would have no problemm undermining the Right.


  113. lobo91
    113 | April 5, 2012 1:10 pm

    @ RIX:

    I wonder what his principal source of income was?

    Aside from the royalties from the two books he probably didn’t actually write, I’m not sure anyone knows what his principal source of income ever has been.


  114. RIX
    114 | April 5, 2012 1:13 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ RIX:
    I wonder what his principal source of income was?
    Aside from the royalties from the two books he probably didn’t actually write, I’m not sure anyone knows what his principal source of income ever has been.

    It is kind of like when Chris Rock asked Jesse Jackson,
    “What is it that you do? How do you earn a living?”


  115. RIX
    115 | April 5, 2012 1:17 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    I would like to see the court come down on the
    case while the mob is rioting in Chicago at the
    Nato Summit.
    Let the Obama mob get all mixded up with the other
    mob & lose whatever message that they are trying
    to scream to us.


  116. NoThreat2U
    116 | April 5, 2012 1:22 pm

    @ RIX:
    Buzz will have to do a remake of The Night Chicago Died.


  117. 117 | April 5, 2012 1:28 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    Buzz -- I’ve always wondered if she’ll resign from the Court if Obama leaves office. I mean, I’ve seen nothing that suggests she has the legal or intellectual acumen for a justice, and she sounded absolutely stupid during the Obamacare oral argument (and I agree with you -- she absolutely should have recused herself). I wanted to scream “you aren’t the effing Solicitor General anymore, toots -- stop advocating for the government!”


  118. RIX
    118 | April 5, 2012 1:30 pm

    NoThreat2U wrote:

    @ RIX:
    Buzz will have to do a remake of The Night Chicago Died.

    That would be good.
    How are you feeling today?


  119. 119 | April 5, 2012 1:32 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    The Circuits, as well as some the District Judges, really got riled up over that bullshit he was pedaling. His daily attacks on the judicial process may not sit too well with even some liberal judges and justices. He may end up with a 6-3 decision kicking his “historic” health care to the curb (I can see Breyer being persuaded -- I think the Petticoat Contingent not so much).


  120. RIX
    120 | April 5, 2012 1:37 pm

    CNN is now waliking back their charge that George
    Zimmerman used a racial slur that was on the recorded
    conversation.
    On second thought, they think that it sounds like cold
    not c--n.
    let’s see, Zimmerman didn’t use the racial slur, he
    did not racially profile Martin, he responded to a
    question & he actually did have a wound on the back of
    his head.
    Never mind, the mob wants a lynching.


  121. NoThreat2U
    121 | April 5, 2012 1:42 pm

    @ RIX:
    Still feeling pretty good after the draining from two weeks ago. Now I just have to convince my sister not to leave her job at Gibson Guitar and come up here with me. Trying to get her to just sit tight since nothing is being done right now. *sigh*


  122. RIX
    122 | April 5, 2012 1:43 pm

    @ NoThreat2U:
    Hang in there.


  123. 123 | April 5, 2012 1:46 pm

    @ RIX:

    Well, RIX, you can’t blame them. That Duke LAX case didn’t pan out for them.


  124. NoThreat2U
    124 | April 5, 2012 1:46 pm

    @ RIX:
    I am. I have no choice, too many people relying on me and I aint ready to leave my kids yet. I’m good right now though :)


  125. RIX
    125 | April 5, 2012 1:54 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:
    To this day, Sharpton will not admit that
    Tawana Brawley was lying.


  126. RIX
    126 | April 5, 2012 1:54 pm

    @ NoThreat2U:
    BOLF!


  127. NoThreat2U
    127 | April 5, 2012 1:56 pm

    @ RIX:
    Oh Helllz yeah!


  128. 128 | April 5, 2012 1:57 pm

    @ RIX:

    Even after a jury found against him, he refused to pay the civil damages -- got some limousine libturds to pay it for him, I believe. Of course, he’s never answered for Crown Heights or Freddy’s Fashion Mart either, if I recall.

    He has a strongly unfavorable rating of 63% according to Ras.


  129. citizen_q
    129 | April 5, 2012 2:11 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    What amazes and saddens me is that so many blacks are supportive of these fraud race hustlers. You would think at some point they would get tired and insulted of being used in such a crass manner.


  130. RIX
    130 | April 5, 2012 2:17 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:
    Sharpton is the worst of the race pimps. As I recall his
    tactics resulted in deaths about Crown Heights.
    He knows that Republicans have blueberry pie all
    over their faces.
    But MSNBC gives him his own show!


  131. buzzsawmonkey
    131 | April 5, 2012 2:33 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    I’ve always wondered if she’ll resign from the Court if Obama leaves office. I mean, I’ve seen nothing that suggests she has the legal or intellectual acumen for a justice

    Of course she won’t quit; she’s farting through silk.

    She has a lifetime job at the top level of government, she will have her pick of law clerks (there will be hundreds, at minimum, competing for the chance to clerk for her) who will find justifications for her opinions and write them up no matter how stupid they may be. And whatever the outcome on Obamacare (which, if it is not wholly overturned, she will try and support and expand piecemeal in subsequent court cases), she also has her mission to destroy the First Amendment and federalism by finding a hook upon which to hang same-sex marriage.


  132. Lily
    132 | April 5, 2012 2:49 pm

    My only wish concerning this evil obamacare is that Americans wise up and look what is in it. Death panels you betcha! What I see with obamacare is actually ~~~~~ no care if you are sick. I do not want the government deciding for me what type of treatment, if any, I get.
    This is between doctor and me.
    Nothing is free with obamacare and it is with your life or the life of a love one that will pay the price for it.


  133. darkwords
    133 | April 5, 2012 3:02 pm

    @ 31 citizen_q: I tried acupuncture for mine and take some natural anti inflammatories. Once called GSE from nutribiotic. And I wore the wrist braces whenever working on the PC for awhile. My posture was bad and a lot of bad habits. It seemed to make the symptoms go away. I was probably not a serious case of it.


  134. darkwords
    134 | April 5, 2012 3:08 pm

    @ 73 MacDuff: THere is a TV show on AMC about exactly that. It’s called “The Walking Dead”


  135. darkwords
    135 | April 5, 2012 3:12 pm

    @ 120 RIX: I think Zimmerman needs a month of in your face front page apology from all the media outlets slanting the homicide to have racial tones.


  136. darkwords
    136 | April 5, 2012 3:14 pm

    Just think if Shirely Sherrod was in charge of your medical care. One might be too white for her to treat you adequately.

    Or what if you are jewish and get assigned a Palestinian doctor who has “death panels R US” next to the Koran on his Iphone.


  137. 137 | April 5, 2012 3:15 pm

    @ darkwords:

    I was appalled that NBC’s apology for its selective editing was “to our viewers.” Mr. Zimmerman was owed an apology, not the effing viewers. “Damn, but we’re sorry you don’t get to continue to think this man was a racist -- we did our best.”

    Interesting — in journalism they call it selective editing. In my business, we call it “slander.”


  138. darkwords
    138 | April 5, 2012 3:22 pm

    @ 137 Carolina Girl: Yes I hope he has a sharp media savvy lawyer.


  139. citizen_q
    139 | April 5, 2012 3:25 pm

    @ darkwords:
    Thanks, I have braces that I wear at night, and do some stretches and self-massage. It helps.

    Problem is I also have trigger finger in several fingers as well. For those who have never heard of it, I had not before I got it, trigger finger is caused by a thickening of the tendons that help to bend or straighten fingers. The thickening impedes or prevents full range of motion of the finger. Sometimes preventing straightening a finger so if it happens in your index finger it looks like you are ready to pull the trigger on a firearm.

    Can’t wear braces when I work, it gets in the of the keyboard. Since I work on systems, bad thinks can happen if I am not careful what I type.


  140. coldwarrior
    140 | April 5, 2012 4:53 pm

    its simple…in health care you have 3 option:

    affordable

    high quality

    abundant

    pick 2.

    its just like a car, they can be 2 of the following 3:

    fast, affordable, reliable

    what is going to happen with obama care provided it isnt gutted is this:

    you will health care available. but in order to lower costs to spread coverage a few things have to happen. get rid of a bunch of tests, lower what doctors are paid, and regulate prevention.

    so, we are already seeing the removal of tests. the funny thing is that early detection is cheaper. or is it? wait long enough to test and that cancer has metastasized and is now stage 3 or 4 instead of an easy polyp or mass that can be removed. see, normally the young dont really get cancer. there is childhood cancer, and under obamacare their care would be limited as well, so many of them will die. who gets cancer? people above 50 generally. well, by then you are already past your prime and ready to retire and become a leach on the government. so it is far easier to let you die.

    watch this occur with hip and knee replacements as well. you will see cut off ages. what will the treatment be? opioid and wheelchairs. this means immobility and suppressed lung function from the opioids, this means problems of immobility, this means pneumonia and death. you didnt need that new hip, you are 70! now here is your smack now go die!

    see, we just lowered costs!

    now, on to the doctors, they make a lot of money and need to be cut back. so the govt will cut payment to them and drive them out of business and the numbers of americans going to the high quality med schools here in the US will plummet. oh my, sez the govt! we have no choice but to import doctors because of this planned and manufactured ‘crisis’. get ready for a flood of jihadi muslim scum educated at achmen’s medical school in lahore, pakistan. they will GLADLY work for cheap here in the US and gladly do whatever the b’crats in DC tell them to! dont believe this will happen, call someone in the UK and ask them what is the native language of their GP.

    this is great for me tho, i can get my hospital to pay for my advanced practice license and make tons of money undercutting full MD’s. I will have min within 6-7 years if all goes as planned. at least i speak english and am educated at a high quality institution. who do you want to see for your problems, me as an american nurse practitioner or achmed with his md from the medical school in kabul?

    the wait times will go up as well as more burden is placed on the system. you’ll get that str4ess test in 6 months (you can get one now in days if not stat right now). hopefully, sez the b’crat, you die before you get the test. see? we just cut costs again! you don’t need that CABG surgery now, ’cause you are dead. its ok tho, you were pushing 60 and were going to become a leach anyway. its best that you as an older ‘unit’ are dead. your useful time was just about up anyway.

    regulation of prevention will be done through fees/laws on ‘bad’ behavior. i will allow you to imagine that ball of pain.

    see? we cut costs and provided universal coverage!

    (i dont want to even get into the tax rates to pay for this)


  141. yenta-fada
    141 | April 5, 2012 5:02 pm

    @ coldwarrior:

    Crap. Now where will Canadians go for health care?/


  142. buzzsawmonkey
    142 | April 5, 2012 5:05 pm

    @ coldwarrior:

    The glacially-slow, wholly incompetent union employees of the MTA are repairing my local subway station.

    They have already re-done the station’s tracks at least twice since I moved to this neighborhood. Apparently, they are doing some element of that again. They are also re-doing the physical plant of the station itself—incompetently, slowly (more slowly than it took to build the station from scratch in the 1930s, by several orders of magnitude)—and doing things that would have not ever been necessary had mere simple routine maintenance been performed at any time in the last twenty years.

    The subway is the lifeblood/circulatory system of New York City. The incompetent maintenance of this circulatory system is, writ large, exactly what the nation will see when Obamacare starts micro-maintaining the circulatory systems of the citizenry.

    It is a disaster.


  143. Lily
    143 | April 5, 2012 5:06 pm

    @ coldwarrior:

    Well CW the short version which I have said is basically…you get sick~~~~~no healthcare basically or bad healthcare.
    People need to wake up to what is ‘actually’ in this bill.
    Do people WANT the government to decide what kind of healthcare they receive??


  144. coldwarrior
    144 | April 5, 2012 5:08 pm

    yenta-fada wrote:

    @ coldwarrior:
    Crap. Now where will Canadians go for health care?/

    just like us, costa rica.

    there are some damn nice cash hospitals there staffed by american and canadians.

    knee replacement and recovery on the beach. i think me and mrs coldwarrior and the coldwarriorettes might have to move!


  145. Lily
    145 | April 5, 2012 5:09 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    A very evil disaster at that too. The government wants to play God with our lives.
    My son has a rare disease. Does he have a right to life under obamacare?
    This is very frightening to me. Very.


  146. coldwarrior
    146 | April 5, 2012 5:12 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    nice analogy


  147. coldwarrior
    147 | April 5, 2012 5:14 pm

    Lily wrote:

    @ coldwarrior:
    Well CW the short version which I have said is basically…you get sick~~~~~no healthcare basically or bad healthcare.
    People need to wake up to what is ‘actually’ in this bill.
    Do people WANT the government to decide what kind of healthcare they receive??

    its not just govt deciding health care, it then gets to decide behaviors. as long as they can prove that something negatively impacts health care then it can be regulated.

    this is so dangerous and 80% of the population has no clue how dangerous this is.


  148. buzzsawmonkey
    148 | April 5, 2012 5:20 pm

    coldwarrior wrote:

    this is so dangerous and 80% of the population has no clue how dangerous this is.

    In a nation where all children’s books printed prior to 1985 can be outlawed and pulped because of an alleged “health problem” due to supposed lead traces in the printing ink, giving the government total control over “health” is an act of madness. It is tacitly ceding to the government total control over your every action and every consumption on the grounds that it affects the public health and the cost you might represent to the larger body politic.

    In short, it reduces the individual to a cell whose obligation is wholly to the organism of society, rather than viewing society as the aggregate of free individuals who view the “common good” as the government leaving them the hell alone as much as possible.


  149. coldwarrior
    149 | April 5, 2012 5:24 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    In short, it reduces the individual to a cell whose obligation is wholly to the organism of society, rather than viewing society as the aggregate of free individuals who view the “common good” as the government leaving them the hell alone as much as possible.

    if i may edit….”In short, it reduces the individual to a cell unit whose obligation is wholly to the organism of society,…”

    the term for you and me, my friend, in obamacare is ‘Unit’


  150. buzzsawmonkey
    150 | April 5, 2012 5:25 pm

    coldwarrior wrote:

    the term for you and me, my friend, in obamacare is ‘Unit’

    Me, knit? I don’t even crochet…


  151. coldwarrior
    151 | April 5, 2012 5:36 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    coldwarrior wrote:
    the term for you and me, my friend, in obamacare is ‘Unit’
    Me, knit? I don’t even crochet…

    needlepoint, perhaps?

    macrame?


  152. yenta-fada
    152 | April 5, 2012 5:37 pm

    @ coldwarrior:

    We have been to Costa Rica and it is beautiful. That said, they are really feeling the economic pinch and are cutting many services. They are a great small country with some bad neighbors. Lots of pros and cons.
    Even if you speak the language, they will know you as a foreigner. My opinion only from things I read on the INTERNET.


  153. coldwarrior
    153 | April 5, 2012 5:40 pm

    @ yenta-fada:

    always keep options open. we have enough points to apply to emigrate to australia as well.

    (last time i checked)


  154. Lily
    154 | April 5, 2012 5:47 pm

    @ coldwarrior:

    That is scary part. We aren’t even ‘humans’ but ‘units’. Like some kind of robot that once it serves it use is thrown into the junk pile.

    You are right 80% of population doesn’t understand how dangerous this is. My brother whose daughter has a condition (fluid on the brain) that requires a shunt is just glad he can keep her own his insurance. The problem is the next time her shunt fails by the time or even if it is okayed to be replaced it will be months before the procedure can be done.
    Not only that like you said we will be losing all types of freedoms. The government will actually be able discrimante against you if you like to drink sodas!!! Heaven forbide if you smoke! What type of foods will you be able to eat? etc.
    Even if the msm is in the tank for bho they have loved ones this will effect yet they aren’t looking at this monstrous bill with a skeptial eye! Why????? Are they that enarmored with bho that they cannot see the damage this evil bill will do????
    To me it is all mindboggling!


  155. Lily
    155 | April 5, 2012 5:49 pm

    coldwarrior wrote:

    @ yenta-fada:

    always keep options open. we have enough points to apply to emigrate to australia as well.

    (last time i checked)

    How does one know if one has enough points to emigrate to Australia?
    / I am clueless


  156. yenta-fada
    156 | April 5, 2012 5:50 pm

    Lily wrote:

    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    A very evil disaster at that too. The government wants to play God with our lives.
    My son has a rare disease. Does he have a right to life under obamacare?
    This is very frightening to me. Very.

    I’m so sorry to hear that. I think the Supremes are going to win this round.


  157. yenta-fada
    157 | April 5, 2012 5:51 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    The term ‘serf’ is starting to look like a step UP.


  158. coldwarrior
    158 | April 5, 2012 5:52 pm

    Lily wrote:

    coldwarrior wrote:

    @ yenta-fada:
    always keep options open. we have enough points to apply to emigrate to australia as well.
    (last time i checked)

    How does one know if one has enough points to emigrate to Australia?
    / I am clueless

    one checks with the aussie embassy and sees what they are scoring for

    here


  159. yenta-fada
    159 | April 5, 2012 5:53 pm

    coldwarrior wrote:

    @ yenta-fada:
    always keep options open. we have enough points to apply to emigrate to australia as well.
    (last time i checked)

    If I were young and healthy and had your skills, I’d be checking out the very same place.


  160. Lily
    160 | April 5, 2012 5:53 pm

    @ yenta-fada:

    From your words to Gods ears! To me this is very scary. Very.
    /for once in the past 3 1/2 years I really would like to hear some good news.


  161. yenta-fada
    161 | April 5, 2012 5:56 pm

    Lily wrote:

    @ yenta-fada:
    From your words to Gods ears! To me this is very scary. Very.
    /for once in the past 3 1/2 years I really would like to hear some good news.

    It helps me to stay grateful for the good things I have in life. You are a lucky grandmother. :-)


  162. Lily
    162 | April 5, 2012 6:05 pm

    @ yenta-fada:

    Yes I am. I love the United States too. I take a break from all the bad news at night and watch mindless little shows like ‘Psych’ or read a book. I am hoping if this abomination does pass the Supreme Court that people will actually rebel against it. We haven’t been brain-washed so much (yet) that doctors are willing to let patients die just because of age or what not. The American people are very slow to wake up…but they need to start waking up NOW!
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    On another note the grandbaby (peanut) was the belle of the ball at my neices wedding second only to the bride! She was so good and such a sweetheart! I got to show her off! :)


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