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The Republican Party needs to enter the 21st Century

by Rodan ( 164 Comments › )
Filed under Conservatism, Elections 2012, Elections 2016, Republican Party at November 13th, 2012 - 11:00 am

There is no question that the Republican Party has a problem at the Presidential level. Since 1992 they have lost 4 out of the last 6 Presidential elections. Even worse, the GOP has lost the popular vote 4 out of the last 6 elections. The Democrats have a lock on the electoral college with a Blue wall running from Minnesota to New Jersey. Mitt Romney ran the best campaign he could, the problem was the GOP brand.

Contrary to others on the blog, I don’t think the vote for Obama was a vote for free stuff. Was there an element of that? Sure, but it simplifying things. The truth is that many of the people who voted for Obama, voted against the Republican Party. For people under 30, The GOP is viewed as a bunch of angry cranks who hate them. For other groups, the GOP is viewed as a evil party that hates them. This is the perception that those who voted for Obama has. Most will admit he failed, but the Republicans scare them. The issue is how to combat this perception and not pander.

One idea is for the Republican Party to put out a positive face and vision for the future. Unfortunately people like Santorum, Bachmann, Coulter and Huckabee are the face of the GOP. They come across angry and hateful. We need to put out those who espouse Conservativism, but in a positive aspect. We need people who talk about not what we are against, but what we are for. We need to stop dismissing youth culture and people’s personal lifestyle. Instead we need to build infrastructure to spread a positive message and vision for the 21st Century.

Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers (R-Wash.) hit the nail on the head on CNN’s “State of the Union” Sunday: “I don’t think it’s about the Republican Party needing to become more moderate. I really believe it’s the Republican Party becoming more modern. And whether it’s Hispanics, whether it’s women, whether it’s young people, the Republican Party has to make it a priority to take our values, take our vision to every corner of this country, to every demographic group.”

She is 100% correct. Every time I suggest better, smarter GOP outreach to young people, Hispanics, African Americans, and women, many in the GOP old guard wave their pointer fingers at me and insist that I am advocating pandering, that I am allying myself with the Left’s divide and conquer tactics.

Let me correct them in writing, as I have done in speech: Outreach is not pandering. They are completely different things. I am not talking about dividing the country up into special interest groups, pandering to voting blocs with speeches telling them what they want to hear in order to win votes. What I am talking about is taking the conservative message, a message that stands to benefit everyone in society, to places the GOP often ignores–local African-American and Hispanic church groups, feminist centers, and left-leaning college campuses, to name a few.

Will your message face resistance? Yes, and that’s okay. It gives you a chance to correct false, media-driven stereotypes about conservatives and conservatism. Will you convert the majority in one afternoon? Of course not; these stereotypes have been inculcated over decades. Opening hearts and minds is a process, not a lunch appointment. That doesn’t mean you don’t get to work. Andrew Breitbart understood that better than anyone.

The GOP has been in this dilemma before. From 1932 to 1948 the Democrats went 5-0 in Presidential elections. Then in 1952 Eisenhower modernized the GOP and made it relevant for mid 20th Century America. Starting with Ike, the Republican Party began making inroads with tradition Democratic constituencies like Ethnic Whites and Southern Whites. The result was that from 1952 to 1988, The GOP went 7-3 in Presidential elections.

Republicans need  to start to compete for as many votes as they can get. They need to micro-target groups and show how Conservative policies will benefit their personal lives.  Instead of dismissing segment of the population, we need to engage in dialogue and win their hearts and minds. Then when elected, show the results of Conservative governance. That is how the GOP will make inroads with groups who currently hostile to them.The Republican Party needs to put out charismatic positive faces to sell Conservatism. The Republican Party should viewed as the Party of liberation and freedom, not as one of cranks and grouches. We should also be viewed as the Party of small business and the working class, not of the rich.

Now is not the time to wallow in defeat, instead its time to accept the challenge and modernize the Republican Party and relevant in the 21st Century.

I know much of what I wrote will not be popular but ask yourselves this. Is what the GOP doing currently working?

The GOP needs a new foreign policy as well. The American people don’t believe in nation building and are tired of nations leeching off us. I will discuss this in another thread.

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164 Responses to “The Republican Party needs to enter the 21st Century”
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  1. 1 | November 13, 2012 11:04 am

    Here’s a segment of that argument by VDH…

    http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/333244/latino-vote-obsession-victor-davis-hanson?pg=1


  2. 2 | November 13, 2012 11:09 am

    The GOP needs to do Marketing, data mining and hire behavorial scientists.


  3. John Difool
    3 | November 13, 2012 11:12 am

    The modern GOP is like Richard Harris…..an Orca destroyed his career.


  4. theoutsider
    4 | November 13, 2012 11:12 am

    Rodan, Get the Mourdocks, Akins. out of the party. Solution number one.


  5. 5 | November 13, 2012 11:13 am

    @ Rodan:

    We need to find a new Andrew Breitbart. We lost more than a friend when we lost Andy -- we lost the pop culture bridge he was trying to erect.


  6. 6 | November 13, 2012 11:13 am

    @ Mike C.:

    Here’s a related article.

    The big problem seems to be the GOP does not do a good job articulating their economic argument and how it can benefit people.


  7. 7 | November 13, 2012 11:14 am

    John Difool wrote:

    The modern GOP is like Richard Harris…..an Orca destroyed his career.

    That movie was horrible.


  8. 8 | November 13, 2012 11:15 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    We need to find a new Andrew Breitbart. We lost more than a friend when we lost Andy — we lost the pop culture bridge he was trying to erect.

    Yup, he saw the GOP’s weakness and was trying to rectify it. I will be blunt, for people under 30 and some segments of the population, it’s socially unacceptable to be a Republican.


  9. lobo91
    9 | November 13, 2012 11:16 am

    @ Rodan:

    I will be blunt, for people under 30 and some segments of the population, it’s socially unacceptable to be a Republican.

    I hope they enjoy permanent unemployment, then.


  10. John Difool
    10 | November 13, 2012 11:17 am

    Rodan wrote:

    John Difool wrote:
    The modern GOP is like Richard Harris…..an Orca destroyed his career.
    That movie was horrible.

    The ORCA of course refers to the Romney campaigns software, however Richard Harris never recovered from an actual black & white whale & went on to make a few more horrible movies after that.


  11. 11 | November 13, 2012 11:23 am

    @ lobo91:

    And they need to look over their collective shoulder. Every year, colleges and high schools are graduating millions more looking for jobs. Jobs, I might add, that aren’t being added. But they aren’t being counted in the unemployed number -- because they can’t make jobless claims because they’ve never been employed in a capacity that allows them to collect unemployment.

    The media was very invested in making sure the consequences of Obamacare were not publicized and that the economy was actually in much much better shape than it was.


  12. lobo91
    12 | November 13, 2012 11:29 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    You know who else won’t be counted in the unemployment stats?

    All the military personnel who are forced out as a result of Obama’s cuts.


  13. 13 | November 13, 2012 11:30 am

    @ John Difool:

    I know that. It was a horrible movie anyway. The name alone was ominus.


  14. 14 | November 13, 2012 11:31 am

    @ lobo91:

    They need to see a connection, hence the GOP needs to build infrastructure. Mars poinmted out that these rich Conservative donors should start buyting legacy media. That way our messaging can gte out.


  15. Guggi
    15 | November 13, 2012 11:32 am

    brwahahahahahaha

    Petraeus investigation ensnares commander of U.S., NATO troops in Afghanistan

    The FBI probe into the sex scandal that prompted CIA Director David Petraeus to resign has expanded to ensnare Gen. John R. Allen, the commander of U.S. and NATO troops in Afghanistan, the Pentagon announced early Tuesday.

    According to a senior U.S. defense official, the FBI has uncovered between 20,000 and 30,000 pages of documents — most of them e-mails — that contain “potentially inappropriate” communication between Allen and Jill Kelley, the 37-year-old Tampa woman whose report of harassment by a person who turned out to be Petraeus’s mistress ultimately led to Petraeus’s downfall.


  16. lobo91
    16 | November 13, 2012 11:32 am

    I need to find a way to make people put down deposits for classes.

    This is the third time in 10 days that I’ve set everything up for a class only to have the person be a no-show.


  17. lobo91
    17 | November 13, 2012 11:33 am

    @ Guggi:

    This story is getting more convoluted by the minute.


  18. theoutsider
    18 | November 13, 2012 11:34 am

    The president, and the speaker will cut a deal. It’ll be preferential toward the White House. What else do you expect?


  19. 19 | November 13, 2012 11:37 am

    @ theoutsider:

    What does this have to do with the subject? For the record I am for rasing taxes on the rich. They vote foir your party anyway. Guess what, it will not make a dent on the deficit.


  20. lobo91
    20 | November 13, 2012 11:37 am

    theoutsider wrote:

    The president, and the speaker will cut a deal. It’ll be preferential toward the White House. What else do you expect?

    Some actual leadership would be nice, but that’s too much to ask.


  21. Guggi
    21 | November 13, 2012 11:37 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Guggi:
    This story is getting more convoluted by the minute.

    popcorn :-)


  22. lobo91
    22 | November 13, 2012 11:40 am

    Guggi wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Guggi:
    This story is getting more convoluted by the minute.

    popcorn

    I’m afraid that it’s just the latest shiny object dangled out there to distract the public from the imminent demise of our country.


  23. heysoos
    23 | November 13, 2012 11:40 am

    theoutsider wrote:

    The president, and the speaker will cut a deal. It’ll be preferential toward the White House. What else do you expect?

    how much debt is too much?


  24. John Difool
    24 | November 13, 2012 11:40 am

    Guggi wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    @ Guggi:
    This story is getting more convoluted by the minute.
    popcorn

    You just know Bill Clinton is beside himself right now that he wasn’t in on that action.


  25. lobo91
    26 | November 13, 2012 11:41 am

    John Difool wrote:

    Guggi wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    @ Guggi:
    This story is getting more convoluted by the minute.
    popcorn

    You just know Bill Clinton is beside himself right now that he wasn’t in on that action.

    Are we sure of that? The story’s not over yet.


  26. 27 | November 13, 2012 11:41 am

    @ lobo91:

    I still don’t get what the Outsider’s point has to do with the subject here? I didn’t realize I did a post about the Fiscal cliff. He must be waiting for talking points emails!


  27. Guggi
    28 | November 13, 2012 11:42 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    I’m afraid that it’s just the latest shiny object dangled out there to distract the public from the imminent demise of our country.

    I just read an article in an Austrian left wing weekly claiming how good the U.S.-economy is doing (because of O.) compared with the Europeans. Pure insanity.


  28. lobo91
    29 | November 13, 2012 11:42 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    I still don’t get what the Outsider’s point has to do with the subject here? I didn’t realize I did a post about the Fiscal cliff. He must be waiting for talking points emails!

    Were you expecting anything relevant out of him?


  29. 30 | November 13, 2012 11:42 am

    huckfunn wrote:

    Mark Levin to Karl Rove: ‘Get the hell off the stage already, will you pal?’

    Oh Oh, Levin insulted Rove! How dare he!

    :lol:


  30. 31 | November 13, 2012 11:43 am

    @ Guggi:

    Hey growing 1.5 -- 2% is better than 1% I guess!


  31. Guggi
    32 | November 13, 2012 11:43 am

    John Difool wrote:

    You just know Bill Clinton is beside himself right now that he wasn’t in on that action.

    hmm….all in ? :-P


  32. 33 | November 13, 2012 11:43 am

    @ lobo91:

    It’s just amazing how he’s not addressing any relevant point.


  33. theoutsider
    34 | November 13, 2012 11:43 am

    @ Rodan:
    Inform me on that conment?


  34. lobo91
    35 | November 13, 2012 11:44 am

    @ Guggi:

    I just read an article in an Austrian left wing weekly claiming how good the U.S.-economy is doing (because of O.) compared with the Europeans. Pure insanity.

    That’s like comparing the people whose houses were only flooded by the storm to those whose houses were flooded and then burned down.


  35. lobo91
    36 | November 13, 2012 11:44 am

    Rodan wrote:

    huckfunn wrote:

    Mark Levin to Karl Rove: ‘Get the hell off the stage already, will you pal?’

    Oh Oh, Levin insulted Rove! How dare he!

    He does that pretty much daily.


  36. John Difool
    37 | November 13, 2012 11:46 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    John Difool wrote:

    Guggi wrote:
    lobo91 wrote:
    @ Guggi:
    This story is getting more convoluted by the minute.
    popcorn
    You just know Bill Clinton is beside himself right now that he wasn’t in on that action.

    Are we sure of that? The story’s not over yet.

    If Bill Clinton becomes a part of this I hope it involves midgets, whips & donkeys….and theres video of it.


  37. Guggi
    38 | November 13, 2012 11:48 am

    John Difool wrote:

    If Bill Clinton becomes a part of this I hope it involves midgets, whips & donkeys….and theres video of it.

    Genußspecht (and, I don’t translate it :-P )


  38. 39 | November 13, 2012 11:48 am

    theoutsider wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Inform me on that conment?

    Can you address my post. Thank you.


  39. lobo91
    40 | November 13, 2012 11:48 am

    @ John Difool:

    If Bill Clinton becomes a part of this I hope it involves midgets, whips & donkeys….and theres video of it.

    Put it on pay-per-view and you might solve the deficit problem.


  40. John Difool
    41 | November 13, 2012 11:49 am

    Guggi wrote:

    John Difool wrote:
    You just know Bill Clinton is beside himself right now that he wasn’t in on that action.
    hmm….all in ?

    Speaking of Broadwell’s book, this actually happened.

    That’s our media


  41. lobo91
    42 | November 13, 2012 11:51 am

    @ John Difool:

    Local TV news stations are just so professional…
    //


  42. Buffalobob
    43 | November 13, 2012 11:51 am

    The Republican party needs to start passing out “Tickle Me Elmo Dolls


  43. John Difool
    44 | November 13, 2012 11:53 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ John Difool:
    Local TV news stations are just so professional…
    //

    Loads upon loads of fact checking.

    Although I’ll admit, I had to pick myself up off of the floor when I saw that. One of the few times when I love our media.


  44. lobo91
    45 | November 13, 2012 11:54 am

    Buffalobob wrote:

    The Republican party needs to start passing out “Tickle Me Elmo Dolls

    Let’s not:

    Kevin Clash: Elmo puppeteer accused of underage relationship

    The puppeteer behind the “Sesame Street” character Elmo has taken a leave of absence from the children’s television show to contest allegations, disputed by the performer and producers, that he had a sexual relationship with a 16-year-old boy, the show’s production company said on Monday.

    New York-based Sesame Workshop said in a statement that its own inquiry, including interviews with the now 23-year-old accuser, concluded that claims of underage sexual conduct against puppeteer Kevin Clash were unsubstantiated.


  45. 46 | November 13, 2012 11:54 am

    @ huckfunn:

    I love it when Mark goes off on Rove “oh look there’s Karl Rove and look! He has a WHITE BOARD!”

    Well, in the last two elections we ran the candidates that Rove, et al. told us we needed to run. Both of them had to name genuine conservatives as their running mates in order to stave off a complete collapse.

    We lost the moment Mitt Romney answered that ridiculous question on birth control, planted by George Stephanopolous at the request of the Democrats and the White House. And frankly, folks, the MSM should not be moderating ANY GOP primary debates -- their sole mission is to find a way to discredit every one of the people standing on that stage in one way or another.


  46. John Difool
    47 | November 13, 2012 11:54 am

    Buffalobob wrote:

    The Republican party needs to start passing out “Tickle Me Elmo Dolls

    Not so fast, the guy who does the voice for Elmo is now accused of being a pedophile.


  47. theoutsider
    48 | November 13, 2012 11:54 am

    @ Rodan:
    The Fiscal Cliff?


  48. huckfunn
    49 | November 13, 2012 11:55 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ John Difool:

    Local TV news stations are just so professional…
    //

    Farm teams for the big time bozos at MSNBC, etc… Now there’s some professionalism. :roll:


  49. lobo91
    50 | November 13, 2012 11:58 am

    huckfunn wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ John Difool:

    Local TV news stations are just so professional…
    //

    Farm teams for the big time bozos at MSNBC, etc… Now there’s some professionalism.

    And Denver is a major market.

    We have our own stations here in Colorado Springs. I pretty much only watch them to see what the weather is going to be during the winter.


  50. 51 | November 13, 2012 12:15 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    @ John Difool:
    Local TV news stations are just so professional…
    //

    Loads upon loads of fact checking.
    Although I’ll admit, I had to pick myself up off of the floor when I saw that. One of the few times when I love our media.

    Will I go to Hell for thinking Broadwell has it coming?

    huckfunn wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    @ John Difool:
    Local TV news stations are just so professional…
    //

    Farm teams for the big time bozos at MSNBC, etc… Now there’s some professionalism.

    Indeed.


  51. lobo91
    52 | November 13, 2012 12:16 pm

    Arizona woman allegedly runs over husband with car after learning he didn’t vote

    A pregnant Arizona woman was arrested after allegedly running over her husband with her SUV upon discovering he did not vote in last week’s election.

    Police say 28-year-old Holly Solomon was enraged when she discovered her husband Daniel did not vote because she believes President Obama’s re-election will bring hardship to their family, MyFoxPhoenix.com reports.

    Witnesses say Daniel Solomon attempted hiding behind a light post to escape his wife’s wrath and was running away when he was struck. He is now in critical condition at a local hospital.

    Holly Solomon, who is six month pregnant, reportedly told officers she was only trying to scare her husband but accidentally hit the gas instead of the break.


  52. huckfunn
    53 | November 13, 2012 12:17 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    We have our own stations here in Colorado Springs. I pretty much only watch them to see what the weather is going to be during the winter.

    Same thing in Austin. The local anchors are always joyfully chirping about the enviroquackism of the day. I don’t even go to them for the weather.


  53. 54 | November 13, 2012 12:18 pm

    @ lobo91:

    I can picture the headlines now:

    “MITT ROMNEY RESPONSIBLE FOR ATTEMPTED MURDER IN ARIZONA.”


  54. heysoos
    55 | November 13, 2012 12:20 pm

    huckfunn wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    We have our own stations here in Colorado Springs. I pretty much only watch them to see what the weather is going to be during the winter.
    Same thing in Austin. The local anchors are always joyfully chirping about the enviroquackism of the day. I don’t even go to them for the weather.

    I use WeatherBug…it’s very accurate and nation wide…and it’s free


  55. Purre
    56 | November 13, 2012 12:20 pm

    @ lobo91:
    She certainly was right, but why hurry so much?


  56. 57 | November 13, 2012 12:21 pm

    @ heysoos:

    I use my iPhone.


  57. 58 | November 13, 2012 12:22 pm

    @ Purre:

    I seriously love that avatar.


  58. Purre
    59 | November 13, 2012 12:24 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:
    I cropped it from the picture in which left to the brave little penguin and the polar bear is a female penguin with handbag. Absolutely hilarious.


  59. Purre
    60 | November 13, 2012 12:26 pm

    You can find the picture by googling “penguin polar bear” and you’ll see it right away.


  60. darkwords
    61 | November 13, 2012 12:36 pm

    @ 52 lobo91: Seems reasonable to me.


  61. 62 | November 13, 2012 12:44 pm

    theoutsider wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Inform me on that conment?

    Tell me again, genius, what is your plan for when the National Debt hits 150% of GDP in 2016?


  62. My 2 Cents
    63 | November 13, 2012 12:45 pm

    Now is not the time to wallow in defeat, instead its time to accept the challenge and modernize the Republican Party and relevant in the 21st Century.

    That presupposes that the voters are truly open to the ideas that we support. Many of them are, but not enough. There are two reasons: 1. We have slept too long, allowing progressives and other anti-Americans to fully take over education, entertainment, and the news media. 2. Demography is destiny. By losing the demography battle, we lose the war for civilization.

    More clever politics will not win this war for us. If we are to win at all, it will most likely be due to events that are, at this stage, pretty much beyond our control. Such events include, but are not limited to, economic collapse and/or hyperinflation (we are on the path to those right now) and nuclear war (such as initiated or triggered by Iran, North Korea, or Pakistan, among others).

    We live in interesting times. Our political battles are, ironically, going to look rather small soon, as we shift instead toward battles for survival.

    Possible scenarios ahead: 1. Argentina-style economic collapse; 2. EU-style economic stagnation and Islamization; 3. Imposition of martial law (think TSA on a double-dose of steroids) and/or single-party mobster-style (aka, Chicago mafia) rule nationwide.

    Pick your apocalyptic scenario — at least one actually lies ahead. Enjoy.


  63. MikeA
    64 | November 13, 2012 12:52 pm

    @ My 2 Cents:

    I agree with your assessment. I think the economic collapse with a combination of one party rule / suspension of the consitution as the govt tries to retain power. There will be plenty of people willing to sell out their neighbors to get crumbs from the govt. It has happened in history before. Rich republic don’t last. A shame but people are still the same. We just have cool gadgets now.


  64. 65 | November 13, 2012 12:56 pm

    My 2 Cents wrote:

    Pick your apocalyptic scenario — at least one actually lies ahead. Enjoy.

    Actually, I think our economic collapse will more resemble the break-up of the Former Soviet Union. Some parts of the Country will do fairly well from it. Other parts (think Dearbornistan and Detriot) will become unlivable even by Third-World standards. I don’t think, though, that there will be a general Civil War. The Debtor States might like to hold the Sovlvent States by force to take money from them, but they will lack the resources to prosecute an actual war.


  65. MikeA
    66 | November 13, 2012 12:59 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    The problem will be that conservatives are a majority in a few states. A better way to look would be by county. Then you see the country is really red except for the metropolitan areas. I think it will be a warm civil war. A lot of people won’t want a break up unless we have a complete collapse. And if we collapse economically, it will make Argentina look like a party.


  66. 67 | November 13, 2012 1:13 pm

    @ MikeA:

    I think economic collapse is inevitable now. Obama will add at least another $5 trillion to the debt over the next four years. That’ll put us right at $21 trillion. GDP right now is $16 trillion, but I expect that to go down over the next four years. Not a whole lot, but by a couple of percent a year. Tax revenues will drop, too, so total spending may top the $5 trillion mark. That is simply unsustainable. Sooner or later China and our other creditors are going to figure this out, interest rates will rise, and then we go over the real Fiscal Cliff. What happens when the government runs out of money? That’s the big question. They can’t really squeeze any more. Raising taxes will just shrink the tax base as places close up shop or move overseas. The wealthy will take their money and go elsewhere, and the Middle Class just doesn’t have it to give. When FedZilla runs out of cash, Medicare Payments stop. Government employees quit getting paid. It’ll be interesting to see how they handle it. People on th edole will riot when their dole is cut off. When all that happens, the centrifugal forces that are already at play in our country will take over. There are a lot of States that are mostly GOP. Like you said, it is just the big urban areas, and economic collapse will make them untenable. Things may get warm as those areas come apart, but I am thinking more urban riots than an actual Blue on Red Civil War. The question is, which state will be the first to leave? And how many will follow? It is all well and good to say if we don’t hng together we’ll all hang seperately, but the truth is that the States that are in sound fiscal shape don’t have to hang at all.


  67. 68 | November 13, 2012 1:14 pm

    @ MikeA:

    Economic collapse is in the cards -- you cannot run up this much debt without consequences -- and you cannot tax and print your way out of it.
    This was the problem conservatives and libertarians had with George Bush and the RINO Republican Congress -- which is why they voted the way they did (or more precisely, DIDN’T vote the way they did) in 2006. Remember, Nazi Nancy ran her stable of candidates as fiscal conservatives, believing that when she got them sworn in and installed herself as Speaker, they’d be forced to vote the way she wanted. She was a bit surprised when many of them didn’t.


  68. 69 | November 13, 2012 1:15 pm

    @ My 2 Cents:

    The problem is the GOP doiesn’t even try to win over voters. They assum people will vote for us. They have ceeded large swaths of the population to the Democrtas. They have to start to fight to sell their message. One way is stop defending the rich. They vote Democratic.


  69. heysoos
    70 | November 13, 2012 1:19 pm

    what does the Dept of Ed do that states cannot?….give them 48hrs to answer or ax the entire department


  70. MikeA
    71 | November 13, 2012 1:20 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:
    @ Iron Fist:

    Totally agree. We are in an unstainable economic model. People also want the “good ole’ days” to return. Sorry, those days are gone. No more using your home as an ATM. When the EBT cards stop working, or the price of food is so high that it doesn’t matter what fake money they put on them, its over. There will be riots at that point. Thats when having the 3 B’s will be critical. ( Beans, Bullets and Band-aids)


  71. 72 | November 13, 2012 1:22 pm

    The End of the Upper Middle Class?

    It’s no surprise that working couples in big cities are struggling to raise children while paying off mortgages and student debt. What is surprising is that they’re lumped in with the so-called “wealthy” if they jointly earn $250,000 a year.

    The fiscal cliff has added a new sense of urgency to the tax hikes that President Obama plans to impose on America’s wealthiest citizens. Obama starts the meter at $250,000, and it goes up from there. The tax increases on high-income earners would deliver about $42 billion in 2013. They would create a small 0.1 percent drag on GDP, according to CBO, but their real cost might be much steeper.

    Those tax increases aren’t the only ones that would kick in next year. In California, new tax propositions will create four new brackets for earners making $250,000 or more. Those taxpayers will see their state income taxes jump between 10.6 percent and 32.2 percent, depending on which of the four brackets they fall into. Other states in fiscal straits could follow suit, and Republicans, among others, worry that soaking the rich could weigh on consumer spending and leave the entire economy under water.

    Discretionary consumer spending is the engine that drives the U.S. economy. And high-income earners drive it more than middle and low-income earners. Gallup’s daily tracking of consumer spending showed a dip last month among upper-income consumers – an average of $116 per day, down from $126 in September. If that dip continues into the holiday buying season, the economy could have a setback.

    And that doesn’t address the fact that many, many small businesses pay taxes as individuals. When these taxes go up, they go up on these small businesses. These companies usually have tight margins as it is. People will lose their jobs because of these tax increases. But the people voted for them. There is no stopping them now. What we have to do is make Obama shoulder the responsibility for his tax increases. He’s going to try to blame the Republicans. We didn’t stop him, see, so it’s our fault!


  72. 73 | November 13, 2012 1:26 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    My 2 Cents wrote:
    Pick your apocalyptic scenario — at least one actually lies ahead. Enjoy.
    Actually, I think our economic collapse will more resemble the break-up of the Former Soviet Union. Some parts of the Country will do fairly well from it. Other parts (think Dearbornistan and Detriot) will become unlivable even by Third-World standards. I don’t think, though, that there will be a general Civil War. The Debtor States might like to hold the Sovlvent States by force to take money from them, but they will lack the resources to prosecute an actual war.

    I hope you’re right.

    Otherwise, we could end up with the first civil war that goes thermonuclear. Not good.

    When we have people running things that are stupid, crazy, AND utterly evil, all bets are off.


  73. Tanker
    74 | November 13, 2012 1:31 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ My 2 Cents:
    The problem is the GOP doiesn’t even try to win over voters. They assum people will vote for us. They have ceeded large swaths of the population to the Democrtas. They have to start to fight to sell their message. One way is stop defending the rich. They vote Democratic.

    Not to be argumentative, could you lay out your approach to getting in the door with many of theses groups? Colleges, Hispanic Groups, Black groups, Asian Group and so forth! How many doors can we expect to get a foot in? How do we get them to become more open to our point of view without betraying our principles! I’ll leave morals out of the equation, for I like you feel we lose there!


  74. 75 | November 13, 2012 1:33 pm

    @ 1389AD:

    I just can’t see the military following orders if the President orders them to Nuke Atlanta to keep the South from seceding. I can see Iran using the turmoil as a chance to attack Saudi and grab the Strait of Hormuz on both sides, and declare the Caliphate. All kinds of bad will come from the breakup of America. The people who think that this is what they want are going to be shocked by the reality of it. Europe is hosed. No American cavalry will ride in to save them from their demographic disaster or the consequences thereof. I hope Israel can hang on by herself. She’s got nukes, and can handle the Mohammedans if they try a conventional Jihad (if, and it is a big if, she is willing to sufficiently slaughter them), but Iran will have nukes by the end of the Obama Administration, and Pakistan will likely be in alliance with the resurgent Taliban in Afghanistan. The world looks grim from where I am sitting. I don’t even think we’ll see nuclear terrorism in the United States, at least short term. Obama will have done us so much damage it’d be a superflous waste of a weapon.


  75. 76 | November 13, 2012 1:34 pm

    @ Tanker:

    How did the GOP win over the South and Ethnic White Voters (Reagan Democrats)? They began to stop writing off those groups and reached out to them. It’s been done before and can happen again. It may take a few cycles, but you have to start somewhere.


  76. huckfunn
    77 | November 13, 2012 1:36 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    what does the Dept of Ed do that states cannot?….give them 48hrs to answer or ax the entire department

    Same thing with the Department of Energy. They produce about as much energy as the Department of Education creates education. Squat to be exact. Anything useful that they do (not much) should be delegated to Interior or Commerce.


  77. 78 | November 13, 2012 1:36 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    I say we call Obama’s bluff. Agree to tax increases for people over 1 million dollars. If he blaks, say he wants to protect the rich. I doubt that will happen since the GOP leadership can’t think deviously.


  78. lobo91
    79 | November 13, 2012 1:37 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    Same thing with the Department of Energy. They produce about as much energy as the Department of Education creates education. Squat to be exact. Anything useful that they do (not much) should be delegated to Interior or Commerce.

    The only critical function provided by DOE is in the nuclear weapons arena. Those functions should be transferred back to DOD.


  79. 80 | November 13, 2012 1:37 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    but Iran will have nukes by the end of the Obama Administration, and Pakistan will likely be in alliance with the resurgent Taliban in Afghanistan.

    Look at the bright side, Iran and Pakistan may nuke each other!


  80. 81 | November 13, 2012 1:38 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    Department of energy is just dumb.


  81. 82 | November 13, 2012 1:42 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ 1389AD:
    I just can’t see the military following orders if the President orders them to Nuke Atlanta to keep the South from seceding. I can see Iran using the turmoil as a chance to attack Saudi and grab the Strait of Hormuz on both sides, and declare the Caliphate. All kinds of bad will come from the breakup of America. The people who think that this is what they want are going to be shocked by the reality of it. Europe is hosed. No American cavalry will ride in to save them from their demographic disaster or the consequences thereof. I hope Israel can hang on by herself. She’s got nukes, and can handle the Mohammedans if they try a conventional Jihad (if, and it is a big if, she is willing to sufficiently slaughter them), but Iran will have nukes by the end of the Obama Administration, and Pakistan will likely be in alliance with the resurgent Taliban in Afghanistan. The world looks grim from where I am sitting. I don’t even think we’ll see nuclear terrorism in the United States, at least short term. Obama will have done us so much damage it’d be a superflous waste of a weapon.

    Whether anybody WANTS any of this is beside the point.

    It cannot now be avoided.

    As far as I am concerned, the entire point of secession of individual States is to preserve some part of the US under Constitutional governance, rather than lose the whole of it to tyranny, chaos, and destruction. I certainly hope that the federal government will not use military force to stop it.


  82. huckfunn
    83 | November 13, 2012 1:46 pm

    @ lobo91:
    @ Rodan:
    And Obutu wants to create the Department of Business. BWAHAHAHA! They would create about as much bidness as the DOEn and the DOEd create of their respective activities. Madness; Expensive madness.


  83. 84 | November 13, 2012 1:50 pm

    @ 1389AD:

    I think that will happen, be it the Republic of Texas, Alaska, or the Old South as a whole (minus Northern Virginia, likely). There are places that still want to live under the Constitution. The problem is that a slight majority of our country likes dependancy on the government. The reasons for this vary, but there is no denying that central fact. And it is also a central fact that we simply can’t keep spending the way that we are. The economy isn’t going to grow us out of this mess. Not with Obama in the White House. Too many regulations, and too high taxes.


  84. huckfunn
    85 | November 13, 2012 1:50 pm

    How about the Department of Twinkies? Hostess to close striking bakeries in Seattle, St. Louis, Cincinnati

    On the first business day after bakers went on strike against Hostess Brands, the Irving-based company said Monday it will permanently close three striking bakeries, putting 627 employees out of work.
    The company has no bakeries in Texas.
    Late Friday, the Bakery, Confectionery, Tobacco Workers and Grain Millers International Union went on strike against Irving-based Hostess to protest cuts and give-backs in the company’s last, best, final contract offer. The contract, which was rejected by 92 percent of the union members who voted, called, in part, for 8 percent pay cuts, a company hiatus from contributions to a multi-employer pension plan and changes in work rules.
    As of Monday, bakers had set up picket lines at about 23 of the 36 bakeries and production plants operated by the bankrupt snack maker. Hostess said the strike “has prevented the facilities from producing and delivering products.”
    “Our customers will not be affected because we will continue to serve them from other Hostess Brands bakeries, but sadly this action will result in the permanent closure of three facilities and the loss of 627 jobs,” said Gregory Rayburn, Hostess Brands’ chief executive.


  85. heysoos
    86 | November 13, 2012 1:51 pm

    there will be no secession or civil war…strife of varying degrees…there is no scenario where seceding would be any improvement…sorry folks, aint gonna happen


  86. 87 | November 13, 2012 1:51 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    How about the Department of taking a dump?


  87. Mars
    88 | November 13, 2012 1:51 pm

    Rodan, drop me an email. I have something for you.


  88. 89 | November 13, 2012 1:52 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    Department of cupcakes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


  89. Guggi
    90 | November 13, 2012 1:53 pm

    popcorn popcorn, popcorn :-)

    In recent years, Kelley and her husband, Scott, had appointed themselves ad hoc social ambassadors for military personnel at nearby MacDill Air Force Base, just a stone’s throw from the Kelleys’ mansion on Bayshore Boulevard.

    The parties were how Jill and Scott Kelley eventually became friends with Holly and David Petraeus. They were also how Kelley came to be in regular contact with Allen. Both generals served as the top officers at the U.S. Central Command, based at MacDill.

    The social galas seemed to spare no expense, guests said, and often featured copious buffets, valet parking, string quartets, as well as premium cigars and champagne.

    While they were throwing glamorous parties, the Kelleys racked up substantial debt, prompting banks to initiate foreclosure proceedings on two properties and other creditors to sue them for tens of thousands of dollars in credit card debt, according to court records filed in Hillsborough County District Court. Guy Coburn, a lawyer who represented the Kelleys in the civil suits, said he had not been authorized by his clients to discuss the cases.

    Now tell me something about the social competence and judgement of flag officers.


  90. MikeA
    91 | November 13, 2012 1:54 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    Guess he forgot what the Dept of Commerce does or even what it means…


  91. 92 | November 13, 2012 1:56 pm

    @ heysoos:

    Actually, when the Economy collapses the solvent states will have the oppertunity to go their own way. The central government will collapse with the economy. It won’t be so much secession as simply recognizing the death o the United States as a power. Think along the lines of the collapse of the Soviet Union. What holds California and Tennessee togeher? What do those two states have in common? Precious little. Why then would Tennessee be willing to scrape and sacrifice to spare California the results of her completely disasterous choices in government? This country is deeply divided. When the economy collapses, regional difference will be all the more magnified. I don’t think there will be war, just a parting of the ways.


  92. huckfunn
    93 | November 13, 2012 1:56 pm

    MikeA wrote:

    Guess he forgot what the Dept of Commerce does or even what it means…

    I don’t think he ever had a firm grasp of the concept.


  93. Mars
    94 | November 13, 2012 1:58 pm

    http://www.ezrazion.com/reagan/

    The announcement for this appeared in my mailbox the day after the election. Even if you don’t like cigars, please go to the website and watch the video and hear what they say about the greatest President.

    And if anyone wants to help out a poor vet and hook me up feel free to see if your shops carry it and send me a couple, lol. Nothing even close to my area carries it.


  94. 95 | November 13, 2012 1:59 pm

    @ Mars:

    Sent!


  95. Lily
    96 | November 13, 2012 2:00 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    We need to find a new Andrew Breitbart. We lost more than a friend when we lost Andy — we lost the pop culture bridge he was trying to erect.

    Yup, he saw the GOP’s weakness and was trying to rectify it. I will be blunt, for people under 30 and some segments of the population, it’s socially unacceptable to be a Republican.

    If so then how did Republicans win in 2000 and 2004? Stuck on the past isn’t going to be able to address the future. Because you yourself have said things have changed…isn’t that right? For one things have changed and they will change in the next 4 years and not in a good way. For one in 2008 I saw more young people go for the Republican ticket…this year those same young people thought their vote didn’t count …our state will go red anyway. This is what you need to send a message to the younger voters …they’re VOTES DO COUNT. Certainly not becoming what your opponent is.
    /oh but then again I according to you and anyone else who disagrees with me is am a Bushbot. Right Rodan?


  96. 97 | November 13, 2012 2:02 pm

    @ lobo91:

    And frankly, I don’t see “Homeland Security” and anything more now than the “Amalgamated Federation of Airport Feeley Folks.”


  97. 98 | November 13, 2012 2:03 pm

    Rodan, you’ll like this:

    Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal on Monday called on Republicans to “stop being the stupid party” and make a concerted effort to reach a broader swath of voters with an inclusive economic message that pre-empts efforts to caricature the GOP as the party of the rich.

    In his first interview since his party’s electoral thumping last week, Jindal urged Republicans to both reject anti-intellectualism and embrace a populist-tinged reform approach that he said would mitigate what exit polls show was one of President Barack Obama’s most effective lines of attack against Mitt Romney.

    “We’ve got to make sure that we are not the party of big business, big banks, big Wall Street bailouts, big corporate loopholes, big anything,” Jindal told POLITICO in a 45-minute telephone interview. “We cannot be, we must not be, the party that simply protects the rich so they get to keep their toys.”

    He was just as blunt on how the GOP should speak to voters, criticizing his party for offending and speaking down to much of the electorate.

    “It is no secret we had a number of Republicans damage our brand this year with offensive, bizarre comments — enough of that,” Jindal said. “It’s not going to be the last time anyone says something stupid within our party, but it can’t be tolerated within our party. We’ve also had enough of this dumbed-down conservatism. We need to stop being simplistic, we need to trust the intelligence of the American people and we need to stop insulting the intelligence of the voters.”

    It sounds good as far as it goes, but the Devil s always in the details. I do think we shoudl get behind taxing the rich, but we should make sure that the rich, the John and Theresa Kerrys of the country, are the ones who are taxed. $250K isn’t really that much money if you live in a big city, and it is hard to get that kind of money elsewhere.


  98. huckfunn
    99 | November 13, 2012 2:03 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ huckfunn:

    How about the Department of taking a dump?

    The non-union retirees of Delphi had a run-in with that department.


  99. 100 | November 13, 2012 2:07 pm

    @ Lily:

    For that matter, how did they win in 1994? And those wins were even bigger as I recall -- even California got a Republican majority in at least one of our state houses that year. Clinton was still popular personally -- it was his policies and the spending that were pissing people off.

    We have a huge enemy in the media -- and not just the lamestream media of the alphabet network and cable news. Movies and television are also promulgating the same message. Look how often Sarah Palin is maligned for nothing more than to get a cheap laugh in a TV show. Next season it will be Mitt Romney. How are conservatives and Republicans portrayed? The TEA Party? Sure we can get our message out via conservative talk radio and Fox News -- but what about people who (sadly) are so dumb they don’t watch conventional news.

    How many of the under 30 crowd got their daily news from the likes of Steven Colbert and Jon Stewart and thought they were being “informed?”


  100. 101 | November 13, 2012 2:08 pm

    @ Lily:

    If so then how did Republicans win in 2000 and 2004?

    They lost the popular vote in 2000 and barely won in 04 and scrapped an electoral victory. The Dem wins in 92, 96, 08 and 12 was 300 electoral votes or more. The GOP has a Electoral vote problem.

    As for winning over younger voters, the GOP needs to actively combat the Left and paint them as opressors. Right now Republicans dismiss younger voters.

    Here’s a take.


  101. Mars
    102 | November 13, 2012 2:08 pm

    I know anyone can file petitions for secession, but it is amazing we have 27 states now filed. It’s the numbers of signatures that is getting startling.

    Ulsterman now has a Republican insider.
    http://theulstermanreport.com/2012/11/13/republican-insider-new-blood-in-an-old-direction/

    He starts off wrong anyway. He says we need to get in front of the new media. I think conservatives have a good handle on the new media. It’s the old media that’s killing us in my opinion.


  102. Mars
    103 | November 13, 2012 2:10 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Mars:
    Sent!

    Replied.


  103. 104 | November 13, 2012 2:10 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Great article by Jindal!

    I think we should agree for tax increases for people over 1 Million doillars. Obama will balk at this and then we can portray him as defending the rich.


  104. 105 | November 13, 2012 2:10 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    I agree. It’s predicted, by the way, the Dodd-Frank will spell the end of the small bank in America. Too Big to Fail is here, folks.

    And sorry, Gov. Jindal, but I haven’t seen the media broadcasting that it was the Republicans, NOT the Democrats, who rebuked TARP and the other bailouts. They didn’t vote for more spending. They didn’t vote for bailing out anyone.


  105. 106 | November 13, 2012 2:11 pm

    @ Mars:

    Instead of spending money on PACS, buy struggling papers.


  106. Mars
    107 | November 13, 2012 2:12 pm

    Rodan, I’m still developing my article. So many ideas that I had have already been talked about here, so I am going to go more focused on the media angle. It’s still not going to be a huge piece, but I have some new ideas that I’m going to drop into it.


  107. Tanker
    108 | November 13, 2012 2:13 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    Rodan, you’ll like this:

    Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal on Monday called on Republicans to “stop being the stupid party” and make a concerted effort to reach a broader swath of voters with an inclusive economic message that pre-empts efforts to caricature the GOP as the party of the rich.
    In his first interview since his party’s electoral thumping last week, Jindal urged Republicans to both reject anti-intellectualism and embrace a populist-tinged reform approach that he said would mitigate what exit polls show was one of President Barack Obama’s most effective lines of attack against Mitt Romney.
    “We’ve got to make sure that we are not the party of big business, big banks, big Wall Street bailouts, big corporate loopholes, big anything,” Jindal told POLITICO in a 45-minute telephone interview. “We cannot be, we must not be, the party that simply protects the rich so they get to keep their toys.”
    He was just as blunt on how the GOP should speak to voters, criticizing his party for offending and speaking down to much of the electorate.
    “It is no secret we had a number of Republicans damage our brand this year with offensive, bizarre comments — enough of that,” Jindal said. “It’s not going to be the last time anyone says something stupid within our party, but it can’t be tolerated within our party. We’ve also had enough of this dumbed-down conservatism. We need to stop being simplistic, we need to trust the intelligence of the American people and we need to stop insulting the intelligence of the voters.”

    It sounds good as far as it goes, but the Devil s always in the details. I do think we shoudl get behind taxing the rich, but we should make sure that the rich, the John and Theresa Kerrys of the country, are the ones who are taxed. $250K isn’t really that much money if you live in a big city, and it is hard to get that kind of money elsewhere.

    The problem I have is, we see what needs to be done. I get that, but where is the meat on how we start or get our message out to closed minded groups. As my last post asked. How do we get in with those groups? It really seems many will never be open to things that don’t make them feel fuzzy and cozy inside. Truth of what is going to happens hurts sometimes, and does make one feel good. The results of the collapse won’t be pleasant, so people don’t want to hear it!


  108. Lily
    109 | November 13, 2012 2:13 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:


    How many of the under 30 crowd got their daily news from the likes of Steven Colbert and Jon Stewart and thought they were being “informed?”

    This is it. The media is brain-washing people and especially the younger voters. I often caution them at the under-lying message in the movies, the shows they watch and get a dumb-founded stare ..it’s just a movie, it’s just a show, it’s just a book. Yeah..no. Read between the lines. Our young people are being brain-washed so badly they actually thought there was a *war on women* ..Really?


  109. Guggi
    110 | November 13, 2012 2:13 pm

    a money quote:

    A military officer who is a former member of Petraeus’s staff said Kelley was a “self-appointed” go-between for Central Command officers with Lebanese and other Middle Eastern government officials. She was a fixture at social and charity events involving Central Command officials in Tampa.

    and the Kelly’s were never security checked ?


  110. Lily
    111 | November 13, 2012 2:16 pm

    @ Rodan:

    I understand this ….but I do wish I am not protrayed as G.W.Bush worshipper because I don’t believe it was completely Bush’s fault obama was re-elected this year.


  111. heysoos
    112 | November 13, 2012 2:18 pm

    Guggi wrote:

    a money quote:
    A military officer who is a former member of Petraeus’s staff said Kelley was a “self-appointed” go-between for Central Command officers with Lebanese and other Middle Eastern government officials. She was a fixture at social and charity events involving Central Command officials in Tampa.
    and the Kelly’s were never security checked ?

    Guggi wrote:

    a money quote:
    A military officer who is a former member of Petraeus’s staff said Kelley was a “self-appointed” go-between for Central Command officers with Lebanese and other Middle Eastern government officials. She was a fixture at social and charity events involving Central Command officials in Tampa.
    and the Kelly’s were never security checked ?

    obviously not…people in financial distress make terrible keepers of sensitive information…oldest rule in the book


  112. 113 | November 13, 2012 2:18 pm

    @ Lily:

    How many people, I wonder, watched the West Wing and really believed that Martin Sheen, Moonbat and 9/11 Troofer Extraordinaire, was really the President of the United States?


  113. Mars
    114 | November 13, 2012 2:18 pm

    Lily wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:

    How many of the under 30 crowd got their daily news from the likes of Steven Colbert and Jon Stewart and thought they were being “informed?”

    This is it. The media is brain-washing people and especially the younger voters. I often caution them at the under-lying message in the movies, the shows they watch and get a dumb-founded stare ..it’s just a movie, it’s just a show, it’s just a book. Yeah..no. Read between the lines. Our young people are being brain-washed so badly they actually thought there was a *war on women* ..Really?

    I’ve got some ideas there too. We have our own Colbert/Stewart and I will be introducing him to everyone soon.


  114. lobo91
    115 | November 13, 2012 2:19 pm

    Ralph Peters just savaged the idea of John Kerry as Secretary of Defense.

    Of course, the Obamabot’s response was “Are you kidding? John Kerry is a war hero.”


  115. Mars
    116 | November 13, 2012 2:20 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:
    How many people, I wonder, watched the West Wing and really believed that Martin Sheen, Moonbat and 9/11 Troofer Extraordinaire, was really the President of the United States?

    I hope everyone noticed on that show how the Dems were always portrayed as dignified and concerned, and the Reps were always evil, fat, rich guys that everyone hated.


  116. 117 | November 13, 2012 2:20 pm

    @ Rodan:

    Start buying up shares in LA Times, NY Times and WaPo. Start buying up shares in Comcast, General Electric. The Koch Brothers should let Americans For Prosperity start going on its own and forget the PACs -- start buying up media, fellas.


  117. Lily
    118 | November 13, 2012 2:21 pm

    Mars wrote:

    I know anyone can file petitions for secession, but it is amazing we have 27 states now filed. It’s the numbers of signatures that is getting startling.

    Ulsterman now has a Republican insider.
    http://theulstermanreport.com/2012/11/13/republican-insider-new-blood-in-an-old-direction/

    He starts off wrong anyway. He says we need to get in front of the new media. I think conservatives have a good handle on the new media. It’s the old media that’s killing us in my opinion.

    Not only that there is another odd thing occuring too….flags are being being put up side down. I’ve seen many are doing it. Vets too..this is very odd..because an upside-down flag being flown means a ship is in distress….right? And one vet who said he was flying his flag upside down said this country is in distress and of need of help.


  118. RIX
    119 | November 13, 2012 2:21 pm

    @ lobo91:
    I think that Obama must have agonized over the Sec of Defense
    slot, kerry or Bill Ayers?


  119. lobo91
    120 | November 13, 2012 2:21 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:

    How many people, I wonder, watched the West Wing and really believed that Martin Sheen, Moonbat and 9/11 Troofer Extraordinaire, was really the President of the United States?

    Why not? He was a war hero in Vietnam.

    Oh, wait…that was a movie, too.


  120. heysoos
    121 | November 13, 2012 2:21 pm

    the AmIdol chickens are coming home…this is what you wanted, this is what you get


  121. 122 | November 13, 2012 2:22 pm

    Tanker wrote:

    It really seems many will never be open to things that don’t make them feel fuzzy and cozy inside.

    That is exactly it. They want big daddy government to take care of them so they don’t have to do it themselves, and they don’t want to look forward ten years to the point when it all collapses. When we go down, the world goes with us, but these people want their government cheese, and they want it now. They won’t understand when the money runs out, and they don’t have the cash on their EBT to buy their food. They won’t understand why, when Healthcare is Free!, that they can’t get an appointment with a competant doctor for thier illnesses. These people are enabling the Democrats to destroy us. There isn’t any amount of outreach that can reach them. That’s why I am so negative on the idea. It isn’t that I wouldn’t like to grow the base, it is just that these people have built up fortresses of invincible ignorance, and they refuse to even entertain new ideas.


  122. lobo91
    123 | November 13, 2012 2:23 pm

    RIX wrote:

    @ lobo91:
    I think that Obama must have agonized over the Sec of Defense
    slot, kerry or Bill Ayers?

    Apparently, Kerry doesn’t really want the job. He wants to be Secretary of State, but they offered him Defense as a consolation prize.


  123. lobo91
    124 | November 13, 2012 2:24 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    the AmIdol chickens are coming home…this is what you wanted, this is what you get

    American Idol and EBT cards.

    //The 21st Century bread and circuses


  124. Lily
    125 | November 13, 2012 2:25 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:

    I agree. It’s predicted, by the way, the Dodd-Frank will spell the end of the small bank in America. Too Big to Fail is here, folks.

    And sorry, Gov. Jindal, but I haven’t seen the media broadcasting that it was the Republicans, NOT the Democrats, who rebuked TARP and the other bailouts. They didn’t vote for more spending. They didn’t vote for bailing out anyone.

    Jindal is getting a lot of heat here in Louisiana ….just saying. He has done some odd things that I cannot explain. Plus the people of Louisiana are wondering why he isn’t staying in-state and govern. One thing Jindal has done is really cracked the democrats completely.
    I’m a Jindal supporter…but there are some complaints.


  125. 126 | November 13, 2012 2:25 pm

    @ Lily:

    I’m curious -- we hear how much Bush “spent” but how much more did the Democrat Congress installed in 2007 spend before the election? The President cannot SPEND anything -- all spending must be approved by Congress.


  126. heysoos
    127 | November 13, 2012 2:26 pm

    Iron Fist…
    “There isn’t any amount of outreach that can reach them. That’s why I am so negative on the idea. It isn’t that I wouldn’t like to grow the base, it is just that these people have built up fortresses of invincible ignorance, and they refuse to even entertain new ideas.”

    this is it exactly…might as well rely on dumb luck….I have zero confidence in either party…the feds as a whole put us into this mess, now let them get us out


  127. Mars
    128 | November 13, 2012 2:27 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Start buying up shares in LA Times, NY Times and WaPo. Start buying up shares in Comcast, General Electric. The Koch Brothers should let Americans For Prosperity start going on its own and forget the PACs — start buying up media, fellas.

    This is the main solution and the best.


  128. heysoos
    129 | November 13, 2012 2:27 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    heysoos wrote:

    the AmIdol chickens are coming home…this is what you wanted, this is what you get

    American Idol and EBT cards.
    //The 21st Century bread and circuses

    BO talked real good, but Mit had some crazy nice hair….I just can’t decide


  129. Lily
    130 | November 13, 2012 2:28 pm

    @ Tanker:


    The problem I have is, we see what needs to be done. I get that, but where is the meat on how we start or get our message out to closed minded groups. As my last post asked. How do we get in with those groups? It really seems many will never be open to things that don’t make them feel fuzzy and cozy inside. Truth of what is going to happens hurts sometimes, and does make one feel good. The results of the collapse won’t be pleasant, so people don’t want to hear it!

    No they don’t want to hear the truth. How do you combat that?


  130. 131 | November 13, 2012 2:28 pm

    @ Lily:

    Yep. Upside down is a distress signal.
    Occupy Wall Street would do it all the time -- have the flag upside down.
    That is, when they weren’t burning and defacing them.

    Funny, bet OWS is told to screw off now that Jerkface is re-elected. Don’t need them now and they’re an embarrassment.


  131. Guggi
    132 | November 13, 2012 2:28 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    obviously not…people in financial distress make terrible keepers of sensitive information…oldest rule in the book

    that Petraeus had an affair with Broadwell was all over Washington known. Holly Petraeus was best friend with Jilly Kelly and Jilly Kelly went to the FBI. Holly Petraeus who gives the impression to be competent in social and financial matters never asked how the Kellys pay for those parties ? C’mmon he is a surgeon for stomach cancer not a plastic surgeon.

    This is all a morass.


  132. 133 | November 13, 2012 2:30 pm

    New Thread.


  133. 134 | November 13, 2012 2:30 pm

    @ lobo91:

    State may still be on the table for him -- I have a feeling Susan Rice isn’t going to get past the Senate (they need 60 right?) -- it appears Harry doesn’t have the votes to change the filibuster rules.

    Rice is the face of the lies about Benghazi.


  134. RIX
    135 | November 13, 2012 2:31 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Apparently, Kerry doesn’t really want the job. He wants to be Secretary of State, but they offered him Defense as a consolation prize.

    It looks like Sec of State is reserved for Susan Rice.


  135. 136 | November 13, 2012 2:31 pm

    Lily wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    I understand this ….but I do wish I am not protrayed as G.W.Bush worshipper because I don’t believe it was completely Bush’s fault obama was re-elected this year.

    That’s a dead subject right now and I have not brought that up today.


  136. Guggi
    137 | November 13, 2012 2:32 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Funny, bet OWS is told to screw off now that Jerkface is re-elected. Don’t need them now and they’re an embarrassment.

    I argue the Tea party should work together with the OWS on taxing the really rich like Heinz/Kerry, Bloomberg, Soros, Bill Gates etc.
    The OWS wanted to work together with the Tea Party if you remember, they argued they would share similar goals.


  137. 138 | November 13, 2012 2:32 pm

    @ Lily:

    You can only be an ostrich for so long. Speranza -- what’s the price of a hot dog at the Sabrett’s cart now?


  138. heysoos
    139 | November 13, 2012 2:32 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ lobo91:
    State may still be on the table for him — I have a feeling Susan Rice isn’t going to get past the Senate (they need 60 right?) — it appears Harry doesn’t have the votes to change the filibuster rules.
    Rice is the face of the lies about Benghazi.

    I believe Rice is the key to the whole thing too, which might explain HC cavalier attitude so far….much is yet to come out


  139. lobo91
    140 | November 13, 2012 2:35 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    State may still be on the table for him — I have a feeling Susan Rice isn’t going to get past the Senate (they need 60 right?) — it appears Harry doesn’t have the votes to change the filibuster rules.

    Rice is the face of the lies about Benghazi.

    I can’t see them even wanting her to testify at a confirmation hearing.


  140. Mars
    141 | November 13, 2012 2:36 pm

    Guggi wrote:

    Carolina Girl wrote:
    Funny, bet OWS is told to screw off now that Jerkface is re-elected. Don’t need them now and they’re an embarrassment.
    I argue the Tea party should work together with the OWS on taxing the really rich like Heinz/Kerry, Bloomberg, Soros, Bill Gates etc.
    The OWS wanted to work together with the Tea Party if you remember, they argued they would share similar goals.

    OWS was full of it. If you check who was behind the whole thing they had no interest in being anywhere near the tea party. OWS was a created movement. The Unions and the international Marxists were behind the whole thing from the start. Nice part is it doesn’t take much to find out who did what, they didn’t even try to cover their trail. (Guess they had inside info that DOJ would never investigate.)


  141. Lily
    142 | November 13, 2012 2:36 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:

    How many people, I wonder, watched the West Wing and really believed that Martin Sheen, Moonbat and 9/11 Troofer Extraordinaire, was really the President of the United States?

    More than you would want to know I’m sure. The 9/11 Troofers really took the cake and yeah I went up against one. Nicely telling the facts he starting screaming and cussing at me…you can not reach this level of stupiditiy. You ask for proof…you get the same talking points …you give them facts and then tell them to check those facts…oh hell no they will not do that…they scream and cuss and totally disrespect someone who is older than them. Todays younger crowd have NO RESPECT for someone older, NO MANNERS and are FILLED WITH JEALOUSY, GREED and ENVY. Not all but a good part of them and they are also consumed with the fact that GAY PEOPLE HAVE THE RIGHT TO MARRY IN A CHURCH..when it goes straight up against the wall of the tenets of the Church. A civil marriage isn’t good enough for them and these are the ones who aren’t gay!!!!


  142. Lily
    143 | November 13, 2012 2:38 pm

    @ Mars:

    I’m looking forward to it.


  143. Tanker
    144 | November 13, 2012 2:38 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Iron Fist…
    “There isn’t any amount of outreach that can reach them. That’s why I am so negative on the idea. It isn’t that I wouldn’t like to grow the base, it is just that these people have built up fortresses of invincible ignorance, and they refuse to even entertain new ideas.”
    this is it exactly…might as well rely on dumb luck….I have zero confidence in either party…the feds as a whole put us into this mess, now let them get us out

    I do believe there are ways! I joined a mentoring program in my county for a Group Foster home for boys! They are a mess, but can be reached in some ways. Small step forward and would take 10s if not 100s of years to make a difference when I see how many people don’t want to get involved! This is too small to make a difference on a national level, so how do we get in a national/regional level?


  144. Fritz Katz
    145 | November 13, 2012 2:38 pm

    theoutsider wrote:

    Rodan, Get the Mourdocks, Akins. out of the party. Solution number one.

    When Democraps make stupid mistakes — they circle the wagons and support them even more. When ours make one error, we bring out a circular firing squad. The Republican establishment did distance themselves from Akin, and superpacs pulled millions from his campaign. Romney denounced Mourdocks remarks.

    Which is the winning strategy?

    Elizabeth Warren is the most inane, in-articulate, shrill, nasty, lying, 1/32 piece-of-shit, etc., … in the entire state of Massachusetts. Just bringing out the truth about her would have been enough to sink her.

    Scott Brown, was smeared by Warren countless nasty negative ads. Brown, in response, did not dispute the specific votes Warren cited, but called the ad “inappropriate” and accused Warren of trying to scare women. Brown was the establishment candidate, and didn’t want to drive away the moderates so he chose to not respond.

    Guess who won the election?

    (theoutsider will you admit that your strategy is wrong-headed?)


  145. Mars
    146 | November 13, 2012 2:39 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:
    You can only be an ostrich for so long. Speranza — what’s the price of a hot dog at the Sabrett’s cart now?

    We just got one of those here in MT. 7 bucks here, but he has to import everything from NJ.


  146. Mars
    147 | November 13, 2012 2:39 pm

    Mars wrote:

    Carolina Girl wrote:
    @ Lily:
    You can only be an ostrich for so long. Speranza — what’s the price of a hot dog at the Sabrett’s cart now?

    We just got one of those here in MT. 7 bucks here, but he has to import everything from NJ.

    Not sure about the onion sauce yet. But the chili was to die for.


  147. Lily
    148 | November 13, 2012 2:40 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Ralph Peters just savaged the idea of John Kerry as Secretary of Defense.

    Of course, the Obamabot’s response was “Are you kidding? John Kerry is a war hero.”

    War hero??? Wasn’t he in Vietnam only 3 months??????
    And his wounds seemed self-inflicted? That’s a coward not a war hero…not to mention he threw his medals at the White House! Have I got this right…and then he testified against other soldiers too…he is a disgrace.


  148. Lily
    149 | November 13, 2012 2:42 pm

    Mars wrote:

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:
    How many people, I wonder, watched the West Wing and really believed that Martin Sheen, Moonbat and 9/11 Troofer Extraordinaire, was really the President of the United States?

    I hope everyone noticed on that show how the Dems were always portrayed as dignified and concerned, and the Reps were always evil, fat, rich guys that everyone hated.

    Never watched that show…figured it would be so damn biased it would piss me off. Sounds like I didn’t miss much.


  149. 150 | November 13, 2012 2:43 pm

    Lily wrote:

    and then he testified against other soldiers too

    He didn’t just testify against other soldiers. He made up stories of atrocities that he accused other soldiers of having comitted. The man is a disgrace, so it is fitting that the Democrats honor him.


  150. lobo91
    151 | November 13, 2012 2:43 pm

    @ Lily:

    War hero??? Wasn’t he in Vietnam only 3 months??????
    And his wounds seemed self-inflicted? That’s a coward not a war hero…not to mention he threw his medals at the White House! Have I got this right…and then he testified against other soldiers too…he is a disgrace.

    And he engaged in secret negotiations with the North Vietnamese.

    He’s considered a hero by them. That should tell you something.


  151. lobo91
    152 | November 13, 2012 2:45 pm

    @ Lily:

    Never watched that show…figured it would be so damn biased it would piss me off. Sounds like I didn’t miss much.

    Moonbats always think The American President is another example of what the actual president should be.

    Not coincidentally, both that movie and The West Wing were created by the same person: Aaron Sorkin.


  152. Mars
    153 | November 13, 2012 2:46 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Lily:
    War hero??? Wasn’t he in Vietnam only 3 months??????
    And his wounds seemed self-inflicted? That’s a coward not a war hero…not to mention he threw his medals at the White House! Have I got this right…and then he testified against other soldiers too…he is a disgrace.
    And he engaged in secret negotiations with the North Vietnamese.
    He’s considered a hero by them. That should tell you something.

    Yep they credit him and Kronkite with winning the war for them. They were ready to throw in the towel after Tet, but Kronkite came on tv and said how badly we were losing. The generals knew if they just held on a little longer that the US would lose its nerve and run. (Or get fucked over by the dem congress)


  153. Mars
    154 | November 13, 2012 2:47 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Lily:
    Never watched that show…figured it would be so damn biased it would piss me off. Sounds like I didn’t miss much.
    Moonbats always think The American President is another example of what the actual president should be.
    Not coincidentally, both that movie and The West Wing were created by the same person: Aaron Sorkin.

    What I think is ridiculous is that they always use dems for president on all their shows. And if it is a republican, well heck he winds up getting us into a war, or having an affair, or some other corruption. (You know, like dem presidents do in real life.)


  154. RIX
    155 | November 13, 2012 2:49 pm

    @ Mars:

    Yep they credit him and Kronkite with winning the war for them. They were ready to throw in the towel after Tet, but Kronkite came on tv and said how badly we were losing. The generals knew if they just held on a little longer that the US would lose its nerve and run. (Or get fucked over by the dem congress)

    General Giap covered that in his memoirs.
    The NVA defeat during Tet was a last gap effort.
    They were ready to sue for peace, but Cronkite
    saved them.


  155. Lily
    156 | November 13, 2012 2:50 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:

    I’m curious — we hear how much Bush “spent” but how much more did the Democrat Congress installed in 2007 spend before the election? The President cannot SPEND anything — all spending must be approved by Congress.

    You hit on one there CG. Congress is also a problem if they don’thave the where with all to do something in favor of this country and they don’t..they are letting obama run around all over the place. This catastrope lays at a lot of people’s feet. Our government is no longer worker for the people of the United States they are dictating to them; all they way down to what we eat. And people are not raising their pitch-forks over this?


  156. lobo91
    157 | November 13, 2012 2:53 pm

    @ Mars:

    What I think is ridiculous is that they always use dems for president on all their shows. And if it is a republican, well heck he winds up getting us into a war, or having an affair, or some other corruption. (You know, like dem presidents do in real life.)

    Look at how they’ve managed to brand the Republicans as being the “party of the rich.”

    The majority of “the rich” vote Democrat. And most of the tax loopholes the Democrats rail about were put there by Democrats.


  157. 158 | November 13, 2012 2:54 pm

    @ Lily:

    The government no longer has the consent of the governed. It really is that simple. What to do about it? That is a more complex issue. I don’t think much will be done about it until our economy collapses. When that happens, though, things will get interesting.


  158. Lily
    159 | November 13, 2012 2:54 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Lily:

    Yep. Upside down is a distress signal.
    Occupy Wall Street would do it all the time — have the flag upside down.
    That is, when they weren’t burning and defacing them.

    Funny, bet OWS is told to screw off now that Jerkface is re-elected. Don’t need them now and they’re an embarrassment.

    These are patriots are flying the flag this way!!!! States wanting to secede…how in the hell did obama get re-elected is beyond belief!
    Sure there is sour grapes always from the losing side..but this time the American people are actually doing something that I have never seen before…immeditaly after obama was re-elected companies started trying to save themselves with lay-offs, states petitioning to secede peacefully, and now distress signals with un-side down flags.


  159. lobo91
    160 | November 13, 2012 2:54 pm

    @ Lily:

    Our government is no longer worker for the people of the United States they are dictating to them; all they way down to what we eat. And people are not raising their pitch-forks over this?

    As we saw last week, about half the country wants the government to run their lives.


  160. Lily
    161 | November 13, 2012 3:04 pm

    @ Iron Fist:
    @ lobo91:

    Just sickening. That is not a hero in anyway. COWARD comes to mind.


  161. Lily
    162 | November 13, 2012 3:08 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ Lily:

    The government no longer has the consent of the governed. It really is that simple. What to do about it? That is a more complex issue. I don’t think much will be done about it until our economy collapses. When that happens, though, things will get interesting.

    Oh and I don’t like when things get interesting. You are right though people will have to reap what they have sown.


  162. Lily
    163 | November 13, 2012 3:11 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Lily:

    Our government is no longer worker for the people of the United States they are dictating to them; all they way down to what we eat. And people are not raising their pitch-forks over this?

    As we saw last week, about half the country wants the government to run their lives.

    Bet ya dollar to donuts these were the same people in the 60′s and 70′s who railed against the Feds being in their lives.. I know a few who went with obama but in their younger years …oh hell no they didn’t want government in their lives….


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