First time visitor? Learn more.

Syrian Rebels declare Aleppo an Islamic state

by Rodan ( 215 Comments › )
Filed under Al Qaeda, Islamists, Muslim Brotherhood, Sharia (Islamic Law), Syria at November 26th, 2012 - 11:00 am

The Syrian rebels, you know the ones that the Obama Democrats and the GOP Establishment love, continue to reveal their Islamist intentions.  In parts of Aleppo that they control they have declared an Islamic state.

BEIRUT –  A group of extremist Islamist factions in Syria has rejected the country’s new opposition coalition, saying in a video statement they have formed an “Islamic state” in the embattled city of Aleppo to underline that they want nothing to do with the Western-backed bloc.

The video appears to be a reaction to the Syrian National Coalition for Opposition and Revolutionary Forces, formed Nov. 11 in Qatar to unify groups trying to topple the regime of President Bashar Assad. The coalition is led by a popular Muslim cleric and is seen as a way to counter the growing influence of Islamic extremists in the 20-month old rebellion that has claimed more than 36,000 lives.

The statement by 13 radical factions that was posted on a militant website late Sunday suggested the extremist elements — including the Al Qaeda-inspired Jabhat al-Nusra — are suspicious of the new coalition. They rejected what they said was a “foreign project” and declared the northern city of Aleppo, where many radical groups have been fighting, an “Islamic state.”

“We are the representatives of the fighting formations in Aleppo and we declare our rejection of the conspiratorial project, the so-called national alliance,” the statement said. “We have unanimously agreed to urgently establish an Islamic state and to reject any foreign project.” The authenticity of the video could not be independently confirmed, but it was released on a website that carries Al Qaeda and other militant statements

The true nature of the Syrian rebels is not being mentioned by the American Media Complex. We are told that they are freedom fighters when in reality they fighting to create a Syrian emirate of the Caliphate. In areas that they control the Syrian rebels are destroying alcohol.
The Democrats and the GOP Establishment are not telling Americans the truth about the Syrian conflict. They are lying that they are freedom fighters to once again back the interest of the House of Saud and the Muslim Brotherhood.

Tags: ,

Comments

Comments and respectful debate are both welcome and encouraged.

Comments are the sole opinion of the comment writer, just as each thread posted is the sole opinion or post idea of the administrator that posted it or of the readers that have written guest posts for the Blogmocracy.

Obscene, abusive, or annoying remarks may be deleted or moved to spam for admin review, but the fact that particular comments remain on the site in no way constitutes an endorsement of their content by any other commenter or the admins of this Blogmocracy.

We're not easily offended and don't want people to think they have to walk on eggshells around here (like at another place that shall remain nameless) but of course, there is a limit to everything.

Play nice!

215 Responses to “Syrian Rebels declare Aleppo an Islamic state”
( jump to bottom )

  1. 1 | November 26, 2012 11:13 am

    New thread.


  2. Prebanned
    2 | November 26, 2012 11:13 am

    Hopefully the muslims will battle for control of the caliphate, God help us if they work together.


  3. Prebanned
    3 | November 26, 2012 11:15 am

    And it is heartbreaking that “hope” is the only thing standing in thier way.


  4. heysoos
    4 | November 26, 2012 11:17 am

    same game, different players….they just take turns slaughtering each other….if there is a moderate Muslim, he’s probably a Hollywood liberal


  5. 5 | November 26, 2012 11:19 am

    These are McCain’s freinds.


  6. 6 | November 26, 2012 11:19 am

    @ Prebanned:

    Hope isn’t the only thing standing in their way. The bloody-mindedness of the Mohammedans will go a long way towards keeping them from establishing their Caliphate. They kill each other with great joy. There was a bombing the other day in Pakistan that the Taliban took credit for that killed several people. The Taliban bombed a religious procession. A MOhammedan religious procession. They have a religion founded on hate and evil. It is natural that they back-stab each other incessantly.


  7. 7 | November 26, 2012 11:19 am

    @ heysoos:

    Both parties love these guys!


  8. Storagemanager
    8 | November 26, 2012 11:20 am

    Our President does not say a word when Morsi…makes himself Supreme leader of Egypt…I have no doubt the Caliphate will form very soon.


  9. 9 | November 26, 2012 11:21 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    They busted 5 al-Qaeda guys in Lebanon planning to bomb a Hizballah led Shia Ashura procession. I wish they had not been caught. I love the whole Hizballah vs. Al-Qaeda fight!


  10. 10 | November 26, 2012 11:21 am

    @ Rodan:

    Actually, McCain’s heros are al Qaeda in Libya. The same fine folks that killed our ambassador. In case anyone was of the mistaken impression that McCain was trying to get to the bottom of what really happened in Benghazi, instead of being there to give “bi-partisan” cover to the Administration.


  11. 11 | November 26, 2012 11:21 am

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Our President does not say a word when Morsi…makes himself Supreme leader of Egypt…I have no doubt the Caliphate will form very soon.

    Obama with support from the GOP Establishment loves the Caliphate!


  12. 12 | November 26, 2012 11:22 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    McCain has been Obama’s biggest enabler.


  13. heysoos
    13 | November 26, 2012 11:23 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    Both parties love these guys!

    how soon before BO condemns Morsi?….like never
    http://www.tnr.com/blog/plank/110447/why-did-anyone-ever-believe-mohammad-morsi-was-moderate#


  14. 14 | November 26, 2012 11:23 am

    Jeb Porky Bush in 2016 will claim the Caliphate is peaceful and wants Democracy!


  15. Storagemanager
    15 | November 26, 2012 11:24 am

    Rodan wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    Our President does not say a word when Morsi…makes himself Supreme leader of Egypt…I have no doubt the Caliphate will form very soon.
    Obama with support from the GOP Establishment loves the Caliphate!

    As I said they are progressive”s….all progressives are in the same party….the progressive party….until the America people see that…nothing will ever change.


  16. 16 | November 26, 2012 11:25 am

    Rodan wrote:

    I love the whole Hizballah vs. Al-Qaeda fight!

    Yeah, the more the bad guys slaughter each other, the better it is for us. It’s tough for the people who live in the Mohammedan world, but life isn’t fair. If they weren’t brigands, then they wouldn’t be Mohammedans. All Islam is is 7th Century barbarism codified into “religious” law. It is the Rules for brigands on how to divide the spoils of conquest, and they can’t (like all brigands, everywhere) even wait until the conquest is finised to start the fight over the spoils.


  17. Guggi
    17 | November 26, 2012 11:26 am

    Most liberals and lefties in Europe hold the opinion that the “West” should let them become “islamized” and then the people will figure out that they don’t want them and will start to drive them out. If you counter this with the question: “how did this work in Iran ?” you get the answer: people didn’t try it hard enough.


  18. 18 | November 26, 2012 11:26 am

    @ Storagemanager:

    I agree. What the Progressives in the GOP do is throw out red meat social issues to trick Conservatives into supporting them. But is you observe their fiscal and foreign polcies, the Democrats and Republicans are identical.


  19. 19 | November 26, 2012 11:27 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    They are their own worse enemies!


  20. 20 | November 26, 2012 11:28 am

    @ Guggi:

    Hey let Germany go nazi, they will turn against it eventually!
    /////

    That’s their logic.


  21. MikeA
    21 | November 26, 2012 11:29 am

    @ Guggi:

    Ah… the same logic they use for Communism and Socialism. We just didn’t try hard enough. Ya can’t fix stupid…


  22. Storagemanager
    22 | November 26, 2012 11:30 am

    All progressives have one thing in common….the Constitution is full of negative rights..and must be changed or rewritten to give the government more power to help the people.


  23. heysoos
    23 | November 26, 2012 11:31 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    I agree. What the Progressives in the GOP do is throw out red meat social issues to trick Conservatives into supporting them. But is you observe their fiscal and foreign polcies, the Democrats and Republicans are identical.

    I’m sure I’m boring some folks, but it’s refreshing to hear others express the same feelings I have which are pretty far out for most people…this partisanship gig is a fraud…the feds are not your friend….both parties will screw you over in a heartbeat…it’s all one mammoth game and the electorate are just one facet of manipulation….why doesn’t some teenager invent a voting machine that works?…well?….the giant pot of wealth that the feds feed on is neither R or D…and yet it is both….the truth has no more value than a lie


  24. 24 | November 26, 2012 11:34 am

    @ heysoos:

    I had been feeling this for a while. Seeing how many Republicans decided to go into a bubble after the loss instead of addressing what is wrong with the GOP made me realzie how useless it all is. The whole D vs. R is a sham. I wish the GOP would get its act together, but its not happening.


  25. 25 | November 26, 2012 11:35 am

    MikeA wrote:

    @ Guggi:
    Ah… the same logic they use for Communism and Socialism. We just didn’t try hard enough. Ya can’t fix stupid…

    Yes, it didn’t work in Russia becasue it was done wrong. But we will get it right in America!
    /////

    That is what the Left tells themselves.


  26. Storagemanager
    26 | November 26, 2012 11:36 am

    marxism is a progressive doctrine …most people can’t see that…they are one in the same…always were….100 years or more….the same.


  27. 27 | November 26, 2012 11:36 am

    Guggi wrote:

    If you counter this with the question: “how did this work in Iran ?” you get the answer: people didn’t try it hard enough.

    Such is the real “compassion” of the Liberal for those in the Third World. If they aren’t useful for slamming the West, then they aren’t useful.


  28. lobo91
    28 | November 26, 2012 11:37 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Hope isn’t the only thing standing in their way. The bloody-mindedness of the Mohammedans will go a long way towards keeping them from establishing their Caliphate.

    I think we should do as much as possible to encourage them in their infighting.


  29. 29 | November 26, 2012 11:37 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Progressives love Islam. There is no denying it.


  30. 30 | November 26, 2012 11:38 am

    @ lobo91:

    They are doing a good job of that already! I can’t wait for the 2nd Lebanese civil war. Al-Qaeda vs. Hizballah. Get the popcorn


  31. heysoos
    31 | November 26, 2012 11:39 am

    @ Rodan:
    well it hasn’t but that’s not to say it won’t ever again…I just look at things the way they are now…and I don’t like making predictions because most of my negative predictions come true….in general, look at the quality of our leaders…they are third rate, therefore our govt is third rate…re-election trumps all


  32. 32 | November 26, 2012 11:41 am

    Rodan wrote:

    But is you observe their fiscal and foreign polcies, the Democrats and Republicans are identical.

    That is really not true, though. Bush was a fiscal disaster, yes, but not anywhere near on the scale that Obama has been. Likewise on the foreign policy front. Obama has been far, far worse than the worst Bush did, and Obama hasn’t had near the oppertunity to fuck up that Bush had. Can you imagine a 9-11 on Obama’s watch? There would be no invasion of Afghanistan, or anything remotely like war. It would be a police matter, if Obama bothered to even send inthe police. He’d see it as a teachable moment for Americans to learn how awful their Country was. No, there are real, visceral differences between the Parties. The Republican Party could certainly be better, but the choice between the two is very clear.


  33. 33 | November 26, 2012 11:41 am

    @ heysoos:

    This has to be the most pathetic bunch of leaders ever. Obama, Reid and Boehner. These are not men who are inspirational nor leaders.


  34. Storagemanager
    34 | November 26, 2012 11:42 am

    The Ottoman Caliphate lasted for 623 years….only a murder that lead to world war 1…ended it..


  35. lobo91
    35 | November 26, 2012 11:46 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    They are doing a good job of that already! I can’t wait for the 2nd Lebanese civil war. Al-Qaeda vs. Hizballah. Get the popcorn

    Besides all the various jihadist groups, there are at least 3 different countries vying for leadership of their new Caliphate-Egypt, Turkey and Iran.

    About all Egypt has going for it is a huge population. It’s an economic basket case, and always has been. Iran isn’t going to be accepted by the Sunnis as their leader, other than at the point of a sword (or nuclear missile). Turkey is somewhat less screwed up than Egypt, but Erdogan doesn’t strike me as the sharpest knife in the drawer.


  36. 36 | November 26, 2012 11:46 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    The Republcians are slightly better, but at the end of the day, they have enabled the Caliphate as well. Bush was a Muzzie lover like Obama. Bush recognized the Islamic mafia state of Kossovo and declared Islam to be peaceful. Look at how the GOP supported the bombing of Qadaffi? Did Boehner decalre the action illegal? Nope he just sat their and smiled. McCain is itching for us to get involved in Syria. Both parties supported the Arab Spring.

    The GOP may appear better, but the truth is they are Pro-Islamic like the Democrats. The problem is the GOP Establishment is in bed with the House of Saud. It’s not individual Republcian politicians or voters, it’s the GOP leaders.


  37. yenta-fada
    37 | November 26, 2012 11:47 am

    Behind the Qatari wealth, it is Islamist ruled

    http://tundratabloids.com/2012/11/behind-the-qatari-facade-a-chief-manipulating-wahhabi-lurks.html


  38. 38 | November 26, 2012 11:48 am

    @ lobo91:

    Turkey is the economic powerhouse in the region. Egypt and Turkey are allies now becasue they both hate the Shia and the Turkish AKP is Muslum Brotherhood. But eventually, the Arab SUnnis will turn on the Turks. There is no love loss there.


  39. 39 | November 26, 2012 11:49 am

    @ yenta-fada:

    Qatar is funding the Islamic rebels in Syria. They are also funding Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. They are at the head of the snake.


  40. heysoos
    40 | November 26, 2012 11:49 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    This has to be the most pathetic bunch of leaders ever. Obama, Reid and Boehner. These are not men who are inspirational nor leaders.

    I would not share a beer with any of them…to me they are just men, not celebrities…I’d die before I fawned over them, attended their rallies or god forbid give them any money…we have corrupted ourselves with that AmIdol shit


  41. buzzsawmonkey
    41 | November 26, 2012 11:49 am

    Rodan wrote:

    Progressives love Islam. There is no denying it.

    Ever since the first Progressives, in the late 19th century, swooned to the erotic exoticism of “The Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam.”


  42. Storagemanager
    42 | November 26, 2012 11:50 am

    Beck is talking about the Pravda story…


  43. yenta-fada
    43 | November 26, 2012 11:50 am

    @ lobo91:

    I believe that Saudi Arabia’s royal twits are going to fold their tents and run to safety. This so-called ally of the West will be another Islamist failure as predicted by Osama Bin Laden’s father.
    IMO


  44. buzzsawmonkey
    44 | November 26, 2012 11:51 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    About all Egypt has going for it is a huge population. It’s an economic basket case, and always has been.

    It was considered a wealthy and valuable colony when the Brits had it, wasn’t it? Of course, that was some time ago.


  45. lobo91
    45 | November 26, 2012 11:51 am

    @ yenta-fada:

    And who props up the Qatari emirate?

    We do.


  46. yenta-fada
    46 | November 26, 2012 11:53 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ yenta-fada:

    Qatar is funding the Islamic rebels in Syria. They are also funding Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. They are at the head of the snake.

    Large Western investors have lots of money invested there. Won’t they be surprised? No wonder the Islamists think the West is full of fools.
    The latter deny reality. They meet in Doha for conferences.


  47. 47 | November 26, 2012 11:54 am

    @ heysoos:

    They are a bunch of treasonous scum. They have sold out our nation to foreign interests.


  48. yenta-fada
    48 | November 26, 2012 11:54 am

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ yenta-fada:

    And who props up the Qatari emirate?

    We do.

    See my #45. Al Reuters, AP, and affiliates have done a good job. :-(


  49. yenta-fada
    49 | November 26, 2012 11:56 am

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    About all Egypt has going for it is a huge population. It’s an economic basket case, and always has been.

    It was considered a wealthy and valuable colony when the Brits had it, wasn’t it? Of course, that was some time ago.

    The Saudis with their oil money took over the power that Egypt used to command in the ME. “Spice” rules the Universe.


  50. buzzsawmonkey
    50 | November 26, 2012 11:56 am

    yenta-fada wrote:

    I believe that Saudi Arabia’s royal twits are going to fold their tents and run to safety.

    If the Saudi “royal family” brigand clan were to skedaddle of its own accord, that would be a heaven-sent opportunity for a US—a West—with backbone to solve the Arab-Israeli conflict:

    1) Re-install the Hashemites in Mecca, where they used to reign before the now-defunct British Empire stuck them in Jordan in order to pay off the Sauds for fighting the Turks in WWI;

    2) Agree to assist the Hashemites in retaining power, on condition of:
    a) Peace with Israel;
    b) West-friendly oil policies;
    c) Suppression of Wahabism/aid against Islamist radicalism generally.

    3) Declare Jordan to be what it is and always has been: the only legitimate “Palestinian Arab” state. Recognize all “Palestinians” have the right to return there—and provide a one-time financial incentive for them to do so.

    4) Israel gets Gaza and the entire West Bank.


  51. Storagemanager
    51 | November 26, 2012 11:58 am

    We always did business with Islam…

    Treaty of Commerce and Navigation Between the United States and the Ottoman Empire; February 25, 1862


  52. Storagemanager
    52 | November 26, 2012 12:00 pm

    More reports the Saudi King is brain dead http://www.google.com/#hl=en&tbo=d&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&q=Saudi+king+dead&oq=Saudi+king+dead&gs_l=hp.3…3102.7355.0.7655.15.11.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0.les%3B..0.0…1c.1.KpZYaY01ww4&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=84f5e54452ebb3b9&bpcl=38897761&biw=1680&bih=904


  53. lobo91
    53 | November 26, 2012 12:01 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    About all Egypt has going for it is a huge population. It’s an economic basket case, and always has been.

    It was considered a wealthy and valuable colony when the Brits had it, wasn’t it? Of course, that was some time ago.

    Ever since the Brits turned them loose, they’ve been a mess. There’s some interesting discussion of Egypt’s financial situation in Churchill’s The River War, and that was 120 years ago. It’s only gotten worse.


  54. Storagemanager
    54 | November 26, 2012 12:03 pm

    The Saudi King was 80 something…he very could be brain dead…and then a monster fight?…all those standing in line are old as shit..


  55. lobo91
    55 | November 26, 2012 12:03 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    Nothing much is going to change in the Magic Kingdom. He’ll be replaced by another senile “leader” who’s near death.

    The rules of succession there guarantee it. Rather than passing to one of the current king’s children, the crown goes to one of his brothers.


  56. yenta-fada
    56 | November 26, 2012 12:04 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    It’s a brilliant plan except for the U.S. “backbone” part.


  57. Storagemanager
    57 | November 26, 2012 12:09 pm

    Because of the fall of the Ottoman Empire….new countries were formed… IRAQ, Saudi Arabia, plus Kuwait, Lebanon, Palestine, Jordan, and Yemen…..Before WW1…they were the Ottoman Caliphate..


  58. lobo91
    58 | November 26, 2012 12:11 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Because of the fall of the Ottoman Empire….new countries were formed… IRAQ, Saudi Arabia, plus Kuwait, Lebanon, Palestine, Jordan, and Yemen…..Before WW1…they were the Ottoman Caliphate..

    There was never a country of Palestine.

    And Kuwait didn’t become an independent state until 1961.


  59. Storagemanager
    59 | November 26, 2012 12:11 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    Nothing much is going to change in the Magic Kingdom. He’ll be replaced by another senile “leader” who’s near death.
    The rules of succession there guarantee it. Rather than passing to one of the current king’s children, the crown goes to one of his brothers.

    I think the Muslim brotherhood would disagree…Obama is backing the brotherhood…not the Kings of Islam…like Bush before him did…Obama is not a fan of the Kings…brotherhood all the way.


  60. Storagemanager
    60 | November 26, 2012 12:12 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Because of the fall of the Ottoman Empire….new countries were formed… IRAQ, Saudi Arabia, plus Kuwait, Lebanon, Palestine, Jordan, and Yemen…..Before WW1…they were the Ottoman Caliphate..

    There was never a country of Palestine.
    And Kuwait didn’t become an independent state until 1961.

    It was all OTTOMAN before the fall was the point.


  61. buzzsawmonkey
    61 | November 26, 2012 12:13 pm

    yenta-fada wrote:

    It’s a brilliant plan except for the U.S. “backbone” part.

    Well, yeah, there is that.

    But I figure that the more it gets talked up the greater its chances of some people taking it seriously.


  62. lobo91
    62 | November 26, 2012 12:14 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    I think the Muslim brotherhood would disagree…Obama is backing the brotherhood…not the Kings of Islam…like Bush before him did…Obama is not a fan of the Kings…brotherhood all the way.

    The Muslim Brotherhood isn’t going to be taking over Saudi Arabia anytime soon. The Saudi National Guard will see to that. Its only purpose is to protect the monarchy.


  63. Storagemanager
    63 | November 26, 2012 12:14 pm

    Islam can govern with a Caliphate…they did it for over 600 years…we should never dismiss that fact.


  64. Storagemanager
    64 | November 26, 2012 12:18 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    I think the Muslim brotherhood would disagree…Obama is backing the brotherhood…not the Kings of Islam…like Bush before him did…Obama is not a fan of the Kings…brotherhood all the way.
    The Muslim Brotherhood isn’t going to be taking over Saudi Arabia anytime soon. The Saudi National Guard will see to that. Its only purpose is to protect the monarchy.

    Really?…..If Turkey and the rest decide to take Saudi Arabia…who will save them?…Obama…who sleeps in the same bed as the Muslim brotherhood?


  65. yenta-fada
    65 | November 26, 2012 12:20 pm

    Destablization of Syria causes further incursions into Israel

    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/162513


  66. Storagemanager
    66 | November 26, 2012 12:20 pm

    Let’s not forget the goal of Islam…..the CALIPHATE….there can be NO Caliphate without Mecca….it is in Saudia Arabia….the CALIPHATE has no Royal family or KING….


  67. lobo91
    67 | November 26, 2012 12:22 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    Really?…..If Turkey and the rest decide to take Saudi Arabia…who will save them?…Obama…who sleeps in the same bed as the Muslim brotherhood?

    Now you’re talking about a major regional war. Before you were talking about the Muslim Brotherhood somehow taking over.

    Those aren’t the same thing.


  68. yenta-fada
    68 | November 26, 2012 12:22 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    Nothing much is going to change in the Magic Kingdom. He’ll be replaced by another senile “leader” who’s near death.
    The rules of succession there guarantee it. Rather than passing to one of the current king’s children, the crown goes to one of his brothers.

    I think the Muslim brotherhood would disagree…Obama is backing the brotherhood…not the Kings of Islam…like Bush before him did…Obama is not a fan of the Kings…brotherhood all the way.

    MONEY TALKS


  69. bluliner10
    69 | November 26, 2012 12:23 pm

    Let the Turks or Egyptians claim the caliphate, it won’t take 600 years for an insulted arab people to rise up again.


  70. yenta-fada
    70 | November 26, 2012 12:23 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Let’s not forget the goal of Islam…..the CALIPHATE….there can be NO Caliphate without Mecca….it is in Saudia Arabia….the CALIPHATE has no Royal family or KING….

    The Mecca franchise is essential for ‘legitimacy.


  71. Storagemanager
    71 | November 26, 2012 12:26 pm

    The Muslim brotherhood has had one goal since 1928 restore the Caliphate…they now have the President of the United States in their back pocket..


  72. yenta-fada
    72 | November 26, 2012 12:26 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    Turkey doesn’t have oil. Erdogan overreaches, I think. The Kurds are a big issue for them as well.


  73. yenta-fada
    73 | November 26, 2012 12:28 pm

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    yenta-fada wrote:

    It’s a brilliant plan except for the U.S. “backbone” part.

    Well, yeah, there is that.

    But I figure that the more it gets talked up the greater its chances of some people taking it seriously.

    I agree with you on that.


  74. Storagemanager
    74 | November 26, 2012 12:29 pm

    yenta-fada wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    Turkey doesn’t have oil. Erdogan overreaches, I think. The Kurds are a big issue for them as well.

    They had Kurds in the Ottoman times also…the goal is an Islamic Caliphate…they can work out the details later…it was done before…and they are close and know it.


  75. 75 | November 26, 2012 12:32 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Right now, though, Turkey couldn’t project the necessary power to take Saudi Arabia away from the people who currently are there, even if Obama ratted on them. They (the Saudis) have too many US toys. From what I can tell, they (the Turks) have a frigate Navy, and not many of those. They aren’t going to be storming the beaches off of those. A land invasion through Syria? Doubtful, at least for the foreseeable future. If The Muslim Brotherhood takes over Syria and the Turks make their peace with the Brotherhood, then they’d still have to go through Jordan or Iraq to invade Saudi. If (and it’s a big if) they could support their Army that far from their bases. I just don’t see Turkey having what it takes to pull it off. Iran, OTOH, has a big military, and they’ll have nukes before the end of the Obama Administration.


  76. Storagemanager
    76 | November 26, 2012 12:33 pm

    And again I say….The Muslim brotherhood has had one goal since 1928 restore the Caliphate…they now have the President of the United States in their back pocket…….they are close to taking Syria…they will take it…or destroy it…Islam cares little about death and destruction…..Islam will take or destroy….that is Islam.


  77. bluliner10
    77 | November 26, 2012 12:33 pm

    @ Storagemanager:
    The Turks took the caliphate, they were a far different class of warrior, but probably still superior to any arab nation now.


  78. buzzsawmonkey
    78 | November 26, 2012 12:34 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    They had Kurds in the Ottoman times also…the goal is an Islamic Caliphate…they can work out the details later…it was done before…and they are close and know it.

    Little Miss Muffet
    Sat on a tuffet (i.e., an ottoman)
    Eating her Kurds and whey…


  79. Storagemanager
    79 | November 26, 2012 12:36 pm

    The Royal family in Saudia Arabia are fat pigs that like sex and money…they do not care about Islam….the people will rise if the right leader comes along…google Saudi Arabia 1979….they came very close


  80. buzzsawmonkey
    80 | November 26, 2012 12:38 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    The Royal family in Saudia Arabia are fat pigs that like sex and money…

    Well, I can’t fault them there, but I agree with you, they are fat pigs.


  81. heysoos
    81 | November 26, 2012 12:38 pm

    let them have their caliphate…who gives a shit, they will still be killing each other til the end of time…if there is some grand plan, fine…we don’t have to sort out our enemies


  82. Storagemanager
    82 | November 26, 2012 12:40 pm

    The seizure of the Grand Mosque in Mecca in 1979 is a seminal event in the evolution of Islamist terrorism. Yet the seizure is mostly a footnote in contemporary history. It shouldn’t be.
    The Grand Mosque in Mecca is a massive, 7-acre compound that can accommodate some 1 million worshipers at any one time, especially during the annual hajj, the pilgrimage to Mecca centered on circling the sacred Kaaba in the heart of the Grand Mosque.
    http://middleeast.about.com/od/terrorism/a/me081120b.htm


  83. Storagemanager
    83 | November 26, 2012 12:40 pm

    At 5 that morning, the final day of the hajj, Sheikh Mohammed al-Subayil, imam of the Grand Mosque, was preparing to address 50,000 worshipers through a microphone inside the mosque. Among the worshipers, what looked like mourners bearing coffins on their shoulders and wearing headbands made their way through the crowd. It wasn’t an unusual sight. Mourners often brought their dead for a blessing at the mosque. But they had no mourning in mind.

    Sheikh Mohammed al-Subayil was shoved aside by men who took machine guns from beneath their robes, fired them in the air and at a few policemen nearby, and yelled to the crowd that “The Mahdi has appeared!” Mahdi is the Arabic word for messiah. The “mourners” set their coffins down, opened them up, and produced an arsenal of weaponry that they then brandished and fired at the crowd. That was only part of their arsenal.


  84. 84 | November 26, 2012 12:43 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    let them have their caliphate…who gives a shit

    The only reason anyone cares is oil. If (and it is a big if) the reports about America’s reserves are true, though if the Obama Administration stays out of the way (another big if) then that may be on a lot fewer people’s minds in five years. Nigeria has a lot of oil, too, but nobody much cares if they kill each other in wholsale carload lots. Which they do on a frightening frequency.


  85. Storagemanager
    85 | November 26, 2012 12:44 pm

    Top UN Climate Change Official Calls For Global “Revolution” Engineered By “Centralized” Governments… http://weaselzippers.us/


  86. Storagemanager
    86 | November 26, 2012 12:47 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    let them have their caliphate…who gives a shit, they will still be killing each other til the end of time…if there is some grand plan, fine…we don’t have to sort out our enemies

    Because they also want to control all of the oil…and thus…make everyone a Muslim…Ishaq:324 “He said, ‘Fight them so that there is no more rebellion, and religion, all of it, is for Allah only. Allah must have no rivals.’” ……Qur’an:8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”


  87. heysoos
    87 | November 26, 2012 12:47 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    heysoos wrote:
    let them have their caliphate…who gives a shit
    The only reason anyone cares is oil. If (and it is a big if) the reports about America’s reserves are true, though if the Obama Administration stays out of the way (another big if) then that may be on a lot fewer people’s minds in five years. Nigeria has a lot of oil, too, but noboy much cares if they kill each other in wholsale carload lots. Which they do on a frightening frequency.

    peak oil means nothing to me….there is probably far more left than has ever been used…technology will prevail in the end…a greater concern by far is Israel…but we can eliminate any threat to her instantly if it comes to that….blow the Aswan Dam and nuke Damascus…problem solved


  88. heysoos
    88 | November 26, 2012 12:49 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    heysoos wrote:
    let them have their caliphate…who gives a shit, they will still be killing each other til the end of time…if there is some grand plan, fine…we don’t have to sort out our enemies

    Because they also want to control all of the oil…and thus…make everyone a Muslim…Ishaq:324 “He said, ‘Fight them so that there is no more rebellion, and religion, all of it, is for Allah only. Allah must have no rivals.’” ……Qur’an:8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”

    they can only control their own oil, there is plenty more…as for the Koran and jihad, I could care less


  89. Storagemanager
    89 | November 26, 2012 12:51 pm

    @ heysoos:
    Who will do that…Obama?….he will mjust say pardon me Muslim brotherhood…I must go save your enemy…REALL?


  90. lobo91
    90 | November 26, 2012 12:51 pm

    yenta-fada wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:

    Turkey doesn’t have oil. Erdogan overreaches, I think. The Kurds are a big issue for them as well.

    I’m fairly certain that at least 80% of the cats in America believe that they’re close to taking over the world, too.


  91. yenta-fada
    91 | November 26, 2012 12:53 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    The media are playing up this whole idea of energy self-sufficiency for the U.S. Do you trust the media? Do you see the Keystone Pipeline being built in a second Ozero administration? Do you trust the Commodities dealers and their options after MF Global STOLE the money of their clients who were trading commodities and shut down? That’s a lot of trust.


  92. Storagemanager
    92 | November 26, 2012 12:53 pm

    @ lobo91:
    Why do you think ..we have a fiscal cliff?…Obama has one job…make sure America is no longer a super power and she is too busy at home to help anyone.


  93. heysoos
    93 | November 26, 2012 12:53 pm

    the greatest threat to America is not Islam, it’s the inability to harness the will to protect ourselves…it will become us or them and a bunch of innocent people are going to die…either that or you can kiss Israel goodbye and probably a couple of major American ports


  94. yenta-fada
    94 | November 26, 2012 12:55 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    yenta-fada wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:

    Turkey doesn’t have oil. Erdogan overreaches, I think. The Kurds are a big issue for them as well.

    I’m fairly certain that at least 80% of the cats in America believe that they’re close to taking over the world, too.

    Dogs would be better at the job.


  95. heysoos
    95 | November 26, 2012 12:55 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    Who will do that…Obama?….he will mjust say pardon me Muslim brotherhood…I must go save your enemy…REALL?

    not gonna happen tomorrow or even for years yet, if ever….when I think of a functioning Caliphate I have to laff


  96. yenta-fada
    96 | November 26, 2012 12:56 pm

    Back to the dentist. sigh. Running out of teeth. grrrrrrr


  97. lobo91
    97 | November 26, 2012 12:56 pm

    @ yenta-fada:

    Of course they would.


  98. Storagemanager
    98 | November 26, 2012 12:57 pm

    Obama and Gaza was just a show…a game….look what Morsi did when it was over….it is a game…..the JOB Obama has is to make America a third world country…with so many fires at home…she is no longer a threat to anyone.


  99. lobo91
    99 | November 26, 2012 12:57 pm

    @ heysoos:

    not gonna happen tomorrow or even for years yet, if ever….when I think of a functioning Caliphate I have to laff

    I mostly think of the Planet of the Apes movies.


  100. bluliner10
    100 | November 26, 2012 12:58 pm

    @ Storagemanager:
    Thusly, you stumble on the failure. islam is an arabcentric belief system. We need to get them killing each other faster


  101. Storagemanager
    101 | November 26, 2012 12:59 pm

    @ heysoos:
    the greatest threat to America is OBAMA and the fact he sleeps in the same bed with the brothers..


  102. 102 | November 26, 2012 12:59 pm

    yenta-fada wrote:

    The media are playing up this whole idea of energy self-sufficiency for the U.S. Do you trust the media?

    That is why I said “If”. At the level of lying that we get from the MFM and the Administration, it is impossible to know the truth. You have to wait and see what comes out. Obama’s EPA may outlaw fracing entirely. I certainly wouldn’t bet against that happening, just as he killed the Keystone Pipeline and all the jobs that would have came with it in the middle of the longest period of extended unemployment since the Great Depression. And the American People were stupid enough to re-elect him after that. No, I used “if” very deliberately in my statement.


  103. Storagemanager
    103 | November 26, 2012 1:00 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    Thusly, you stumble on the failure. islam is an arabcentric belief system. We need to get them killing each other faster

    AGAIN….WHO is going to do that?………..Obama is in bed with the Muslim brotherhood.


  104. Storagemanager
    104 | November 26, 2012 1:02 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    Thusly, you stumble on the failure. islam is an arabcentric belief system. We need to get them killing each other faster

    Obama is the Commander in chief of the armed forces…and he sleeps with the brothers.


  105. heysoos
    105 | November 26, 2012 1:02 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    the greatest threat to America is OBAMA and the fact he sleeps in the same bed with the brothers..

    I don’t believe that for a second


  106. Storagemanager
    106 | November 26, 2012 1:05 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    the greatest threat to America is OBAMA and the fact he sleeps in the same bed with the brothers..

    I don’t believe that for a second

    Really….what did Obama say to Morsi?….oh thats right nothing…Morsi just made himself King and Obama gave a wink and a nod.


  107. bluliner10
    107 | November 26, 2012 1:05 pm

    @ Storagemanager:
    They will do it to themselves. Turks aren’t Arabs, Egyptians are not Arabs, Persians are not Arabs, Africans, Indonesians, Bosniaks, Kurds, you name it they are not Arabs. islam will never fully get its act together without a strong horse. They don’t have one.


  108. Storagemanager
    108 | November 26, 2012 1:08 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    They will do it to themselves. Turks aren’t Arabs, Egyptians are not Arabs, Persians are not Arabs, Africans, Indonesians, Bosniaks, Kurds, you name it they are not Arabs. islam will never fully get its act together without a strong horse. They don’t have one.

    No…But…they are all MUSLIMS….Muslims have only one thing in common…ISLAM.


  109. heysoos
    109 | November 26, 2012 1:08 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    heysoos wrote:
    Storagemanager wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    the greatest threat to America is OBAMA and the fact he sleeps in the same bed with the brothers..
    I don’t believe that for a second

    Really….what did Obama say to Morsi?….oh thats right nothing…Morsi just made himself King and Obama gave a wink and a nod.

    you are thinking in a very limited timetable….how long does it take for a couple of guys to whip up a caliphate and threaten a world takeover?….less than our years?…whatever BO does can be undone…the greatest threat to America is the same it’s ever been….the voters


  110. Storagemanager
    110 | November 26, 2012 1:10 pm

    Islam has but one goal and that is to dominate the world politically and religiously. To achieve this goal Islam uses two weapons. One weapon is the political while the other is the sword. They work hand-in-glove.


  111. bluliner10
    111 | November 26, 2012 1:11 pm

    @ Storagemanager:
    Yes, but islam is only a binding obligation when “oppressed”. It is xenophobic, racist and will not voluntarily “come together”. If you want to defeat islam, you need to find the fissures and that is in the artificial unity of muslims.


  112. 112 | November 26, 2012 1:13 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Muslims have only one thing in common…ISLAM.

    And Islam teaches them o slaughter one another. Everywhere they kill each other with vigor. The thing to do is contain them, and let them slaughter each other according to the tenets of their beliefs. What we shouldn’t be doing is importing them like they bring something to this country. They don’t.


  113. Storagemanager
    113 | November 26, 2012 1:13 pm

    @ heysoos:
    Really….Think how far they have come since 9-11 2001….pretty damn far…..


  114. Storagemanager
    114 | November 26, 2012 1:14 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    Yes, but islam is only a binding obligation when “oppressed”. It is xenophobic, racist and will not voluntarily “come together”. If you want to defeat islam, you need to find the fissures and that is in the artificial unity of muslims.

    CALIPHATE is joining….that what the CALIPHATE is.


  115. heysoos
    115 | November 26, 2012 1:16 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Islam has but one goal and that is to dominate the world politically and religiously. To achieve this goal Islam uses two weapons. One weapon is the political while the other is the sword. They work hand-in-glove.

    how can Islam dominate the world when they can’t even feed themselves?…by world wide conquest?…with what?…the US alone could kill half the Muslims in the entire ME overnight….you act like Islam will not be resisted at all


  116. Storagemanager
    116 | November 26, 2012 1:16 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    Muslims have only one thing in common…ISLAM.
    And Islam teaches them o slaughter one another. Everywhere they kill each other with vigor. The thing to do is contain them, and let them slaughter each other according to the tenets of their beliefs. What we shouldn’t be doing is importing them like they bring something to this country. They don’t.

    Sunni VS Shia…..not all Islam…


  117. bluliner10
    117 | November 26, 2012 1:17 pm

    The caliphate of yore was taken by the Turks. There is NO unity in islam. That is window dressing at best, but if you are not really welcome if you are anything but arab.


  118. lobo91
    118 | November 26, 2012 1:18 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    Sunni VS Shia…..not all Islam…

    There are a lot more conflicts within Islam than just Sunni vs Shia.


  119. lobo91
    119 | November 26, 2012 1:19 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    The caliphate of yore was taken by the Turks. There is NO unity in islam. That is window dressing at best, but you are not really welcome if you are anything but arab.

    Exactly


  120. Storagemanager
    120 | November 26, 2012 1:19 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    Islam has but one goal and that is to dominate the world politically and religiously. To achieve this goal Islam uses two weapons. One weapon is the political while the other is the sword. They work hand-in-glove.

    how can Islam dominate the world when they can’t even feed themselves?…by world wide conquest?…with what?…the US alone could kill half the Muslims in the entire ME overnight….you act like Islam will not be resisted at all

    AGAIN…..AMERICA WAS ATTACKED ON 9-11….Did America fight back…or …give more land to Islam…we took out all of Islams enemies…WHAT DID AMERICA GAIN?….Nothing…..are we killing the enemy?….


  121. Storagemanager
    121 | November 26, 2012 1:22 pm

    Please show me…how is America fighting Islam?…Most of the Kings and strong men who put Islam down…are gone…most at the hands of America….how are we fighting Islam?


  122. waldensianspirit
    122 | November 26, 2012 1:23 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Nothing…..are we killing the enemy?….

    Not anywhere near their birth rate


  123. 123 | November 26, 2012 1:23 pm

    @ lobo91:

    In Syria it is Alawite vs. Sunni, isn’t it? And everybody hates the Kurds. And that is just the Near Middle East. In Pakistan it is Taliban (Sunni, right?) vs. Sunni. The same is true to a greater or lesser degree all over the Muslim world. Terrorists and their supporters against Autocrats and their supporters, for the most part.


  124. Storagemanager
    124 | November 26, 2012 1:25 pm

    Really…can not work as one…

    The Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC) (formerly Organization of the Islamic Conference) is the second largest inter-governmental organization after the United Nations which has membership of 57 states spread over four continents. The Organization is the collective voice of the Muslim world and ensuring to safeguard and protect the interests of the Muslim world in the spirit of promoting international peace and harmony among various people of the world. The Organization was established upon a decision of the historical summit which took place in Rabat, Kingdom of Morocco on 12th Rajab 1389 Hijra (25 September 1969) as a result of criminal arson of Al-Aqsa Mosque in occupied Jerusalem.


  125. lobo91
    125 | November 26, 2012 1:27 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    In Syria it is Alawite vs. Sunni, isn’t it? And everybody hates the Kurds. And that is just the Near Middle East. In Pakistan it is Taliban (Sunni, right?) vs. Sunni. The same is true to a greater or lesser degree all over the Muslim world. Terrorists and their supporters against Autocrats and their supporters, for the most part.

    And the Arabs look down on the non-Arabs. Then, there’s a hierarchy within the various Arab populations. And of course there are the tribal and clan fights.

    There is basically NO unity within Islam.


  126. heysoos
    126 | November 26, 2012 1:27 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Please show me…how is America fighting Islam?…Most of the Kings and strong men who put Islam down…are gone…most at the hands of America….how are we fighting Islam?

    as for me I do not want Americans dying in the ME chasing radical Islamists….been there, done that


  127. Storagemanager
    127 | November 26, 2012 1:30 pm

    waldensianspirit wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    Nothing…..are we killing the enemy?….
    Not anywhere near their birth rate

    Since 9-11…Islam has gained Tunisia,Egypt,Libya and Yeman..they are working on Bahrain and Syria…


  128. heysoos
    128 | November 26, 2012 1:30 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ lobo91:
    In Syria it is Alawite vs. Sunni, isn’t it? And everybody hates the Kurds. And that is just the Near Middle East. In Pakistan it is Taliban (Sunni, right?) vs. Sunni. The same is true to a greater or lesser degree all over the Muslim world. Terrorists and their supporters against Autocrats and their supporters, for the most part.

    And the Arabs look down on the non-Arabs. Then, there’s a hierarchy within the various Arab populations. And of course there are the tribal and clan fights.
    There is basically NO unity within Islam.

    lobo91 wrote:

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ lobo91:
    In Syria it is Alawite vs. Sunni, isn’t it? And everybody hates the Kurds. And that is just the Near Middle East. In Pakistan it is Taliban (Sunni, right?) vs. Sunni. The same is true to a greater or lesser degree all over the Muslim world. Terrorists and their supporters against Autocrats and their supporters, for the most part.

    And the Arabs look down on the non-Arabs. Then, there’s a hierarchy within the various Arab populations. And of course there are the tribal and clan fights.
    There is basically NO unity within Islam.

    very much like our Indian gig back then…almost any tribe would turn on another for whatever reason…not always, but nearly so


  129. Speranza
    129 | November 26, 2012 1:31 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    They busted 5 al-Qaeda guys in Lebanon planning to bomb a Hizballah led Shia Ashura procession. I wish they had not been caught. I love the whole Hizballah vs. Al-Qaeda fight!

    moi aussi.


  130. Storagemanager
    130 | November 26, 2012 1:31 pm

    @ Iron Fist:
    Alawite is a form of Shia..


  131. heysoos
    131 | November 26, 2012 1:32 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    waldensianspirit wrote:
    Storagemanager wrote:
    Nothing…..are we killing the enemy?….
    Not anywhere near their birth rate

    Since 9-11…Islam has gained Tunisia,Egypt,Libya and Yeman..they are working on Bahrain and Syria…

    nah, just changing drivers


  132. 132 | November 26, 2012 1:33 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    And what have they accomplished since 1969? Look around and the Islamic world is a hell-hole. These people are only a threat because we lack the will to do what is necessary to eliminate the threat. And that is only because they haven’t gotten the attention of a big enough part of us. If they do that, they are done. Their bigger threat is in immigration and failure to assimilate. We see that in Europe all over the place and to a lesser degree in the United States in places like Dearbornistan. Shut off the Muslim immigration, and you end the most significant threat that they pose. Yes, a nuclear Iran will be a bigger threat. I think a nuclear Iran makesa nuclear war inevitible. They are not rational actors, and expecting rational constraints about disproportional responses isn’t likely to deter them. We could stop that, but we re-elected Obama. I think a regional nuclear war, probably precipitated by nuclear terrorism will happen before 2020.


  133. buzzsawmonkey
    133 | November 26, 2012 1:34 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Alawite is a form of Shia..

    I guess Obama & Co. don’t like Assad and his supporters because they are “Alawite men”—they think it sounds too close to “old white men.”


  134. Storagemanager
    134 | November 26, 2012 1:34 pm

    The Arab spring is wiping out the Tyrants who keep Islam down….very easy to see.


  135. heysoos
    135 | November 26, 2012 1:36 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    And what have they accomplished since 1969? Look around and the Islamic world is a hell-hole. These people are only a threat because we lack the will to do what is necessary to eliminate the threat. And that is only because they haven’t gotten the attention of a big enough part of us. If they do that, they are done. Their bigger threat is in immigration and failure to assimilate. We see that in Europe all over the place and to a lesser degree in the United States in places like Dearbornistan. Shut off the Muslim immigration, and you end the most significant threat that they pose. Yes, a nuclear Iran will be a bigger threat. I think a nuclear Iran makesa nuclear war inevitible. They are not rational actors, and expecting rational constraints about disproportional responses isn’t likely to deter them. We could stop that, but we re-elected Obama. I think a regional nuclear war, probably precipitated by nuclear terrorism will happen before 2020.

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    And what have they accomplished since 1969? Look around and the Islamic world is a hell-hole. These people are only a threat because we lack the will to do what is necessary to eliminate the threat. And that is only because they haven’t gotten the attention of a big enough part of us. If they do that, they are done. Their bigger threat is in immigration and failure to assimilate. We see that in Europe all over the place and to a lesser degree in the United States in places like Dearbornistan. Shut off the Muslim immigration, and you end the most significant threat that they pose. Yes, a nuclear Iran will be a bigger threat. I think a nuclear Iran makesa nuclear war inevitible. They are not rational actors, and expecting rational constraints about disproportional responses isn’t likely to deter them. We could stop that, but we re-elected Obama. I think a regional nuclear war, probably precipitated by nuclear terrorism will happen before 2020.

    well said…I can only write so much, but you fill in the blanks…
    Islam and all it stands for is as much or little of a threat as we make it….they make noise, we make glass


  136. heysoos
    136 | November 26, 2012 1:37 pm

    that double quote thing drives me crazy too folks…


  137. Storagemanager
    137 | November 26, 2012 1:37 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    waldensianspirit wrote:
    Storagemanager wrote:
    Nothing…..are we killing the enemy?….
    Not anywhere near their birth rate
    Since 9-11…Islam has gained Tunisia,Egypt,Libya and Yeman..they are working on Bahrain and Syria…

    nah, just changing drivers

    The Arab spring is wiping out the Tyrants who keep Islam down…..the tyrants cared about power,money and borders…the Caliphate see no borders…just Islam.


  138. bluliner10
    138 | November 26, 2012 1:37 pm

    @ heysoos:
    I have been there and done that 4 times, and we will continue to do that until somebody decides that the monolith of islam needs to be defeated. That will require killing but would be enhanced by forcing them together, then let the natural tendancy to hate based on skin, ethnicity and culture to create the conditions for islamic infighting.


  139. lobo91
    139 | November 26, 2012 1:38 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    The Arab spring is wiping out the Tyrants who keep Islam down….very easy to see.

    And those same “tyrants” were the people who kept those countries functioning at at least some level. They’re all basically falling apart, now.

    People who spend all their time trying to scrounge up enough food to eat don’t have time to take over the world.


  140. buzzsawmonkey
    140 | November 26, 2012 1:38 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    the Caliphate see no borders…just Islam.

    Upturned butts as far as the eye can see!


  141. Storagemanager
    141 | November 26, 2012 1:40 pm

    @ Iron Fist:
    Again…the tyrant cares about his state…his power…his money….the Arab spring is about one nation under Islam…the two are not the same…that is western thinking..


  142. heysoos
    142 | November 26, 2012 1:41 pm

    @ bluliner10:
    a showdown is inevitable….it’s important that the US plays the thing right and be ready to pull the trigger….of course there will always be clandestine ops, I just don’t want you over in some hell hole wandering around as a target….they are a far greater threat to each other, just look at the body count


  143. Storagemanager
    143 | November 26, 2012 1:42 pm

    @ lobo91:
    America is feeding them…


  144. Storagemanager
    144 | November 26, 2012 1:43 pm

    Not an Arab state….

    Austria: Anti-Israel Protesters In Vienna Call For “Death To Jews”… http://weaselzippers.us/2012/11/26/austria-anti-israel-protesters-in-vienna-call-for-death-to-jews/


  145. 145 | November 26, 2012 1:44 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    People who spend all their time trying to scrounge up enough food to eat don’t have time to take over the world.

    Exactly. In less than a year people will be starving to death in Egypt. Possibly way less than a year. They are net importers of food. Without tourism, they don’t have muh of a way to bring in the money to buy the food. Morsi will give them Shari’ia, but they’ll be starving, too.


  146. Storagemanager
    146 | November 26, 2012 1:44 pm

    @ heysoos:
    The body count are those that oppose the CALIPHATE.


  147. Storagemanager
    147 | November 26, 2012 1:46 pm

    @ Iron Fist:
    Do you have any idea how much money America gives Egypt…and I am sure Obama has more on the way.


  148. heysoos
    148 | November 26, 2012 1:49 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    Do you have any idea how much money America gives Egypt…and I am sure Obama has more on the way.

    we give Egypt about $1.5b a year, conversely they owe us about $3b


  149. 149 | November 26, 2012 1:49 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    And those that are fighting for it. Assad has whacked 30K of them so far. He can keep going at that rate as long as they are filing bodies into the kill-zone and the Russians keep supplying him with arms. Indeed, Syria is a microcosm for what we should want the Islamic world to become. Assad no longer has the power-base to threaten Israel or the United States, but the terrorists-cum-freedom-fighters don’t have control of his chemical weapons or much in the way of safe-havens to train more terrorists. It’s a win-win for us. We’d do well to sit back and watch it unfold.


  150. lobo91
    150 | November 26, 2012 1:50 pm

    @ heysoos:

    Which is not nearly enough to make up for the lost tourism revenue.


  151. Storagemanager
    151 | November 26, 2012 1:50 pm

    @ heysoos:
    It will never be paid back and Obama will give them more.


  152. heysoos
    152 | November 26, 2012 1:51 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    Which is not nearly enough to make up for the lost tourism revenue.

    especially if they tear down the pyramids…
    what a bunch of clowns…Egypt is an afterthough


  153. Storagemanager
    153 | November 26, 2012 1:55 pm

    I can say the Sun will not come out in the morning…that will not stop it….Islam has made Hugh gains since 9-11…saying it has not…will not change the facts on the ground.


  154. heysoos
    154 | November 26, 2012 1:55 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    It will never be paid back and Obama will give them more.

    I guess I don’t understand your fear of a caliphate…the 3b is just a payoff to leave Israel alone…even so the MB does not take that money lightly…they are that destitute….even a short conflict could easily drive the whole country into a deadly poverty


  155. 155 | November 26, 2012 1:55 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    we give Egypt about $1.5b a year

    Which isn’t enough to buy food for all their people, but IIRC that is pretty much all military aid, anyway. Their economy has taken a header since they got rid of Mubarak, and it looks like it’ll get worse rather than better in the near future. If Egypt breaks down into civil war, it’ll be like Somolia on the Nile.


  156. lobo91
    156 | November 26, 2012 1:57 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    Which is not nearly enough to make up for the lost tourism revenue.

    especially if they tear down the pyramids…
    what a bunch of clowns…Egypt is an afterthough

    Fortunately, they probably don’t have the capability to actually do so.


  157. lobo91
    157 | November 26, 2012 1:58 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Which isn’t enough to buy food for all their people, but IIRC that is pretty much all military aid, anyway.

    Yes, it is.


  158. heysoos
    158 | November 26, 2012 1:59 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    heysoos wrote:
    we give Egypt about $1.5b a year
    Which isn’t enough to buy food for all their people, but IIRC that is pretty much all military aid, anyway. Their economy has taken a header since they got rid of Mubarak, and it looks like it’ll get worse rather than better in the near future. If Egypt breaks down into civil war, it’ll be like Somolia on the Nile.

    I think we are nice to them mostly for their own good…they have yet to reap the monumental failure of the Aswan dam…loss of sediment and a continuously rising level of salinity….in 20 years their ag industry could be gone….I’d bet good money on a civil war


  159. Storagemanager
    159 | November 26, 2012 1:59 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Storagemanager wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    It will never be paid back and Obama will give them more.

    I guess I don’t understand your fear of a caliphate…the 3b is just a payoff to leave Israel alone…even so the MB does not take that money lightly…they are that destitute….even a short conflict could easily drive the whole country into a deadly poverty

    I have no fear…I have been studying Islam..since 9-11 and been posting on it since 06…it is what i do.


  160. heysoos
    160 | November 26, 2012 2:01 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    heysoos wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    Which is not nearly enough to make up for the lost tourism revenue.
    especially if they tear down the pyramids…
    what a bunch of clowns…Egypt is an afterthough

    Fortunately, they probably don’t have the capability to actually do so.

    I’ve actually thought about that, even just this AM….what a riot after all the spew and seething….they go out there and then what?….hahaha!


  161. Storagemanager
    161 | November 26, 2012 2:01 pm

    I also study the Bible..I have no fear of it either..lol


  162. 162 | November 26, 2012 2:10 pm

    @ heysoos:

    Oh, they could wreck the Sphinx and the Pyramids. If Morsi decided to go that route, they could just drive a few Abrams main battle tanks out there and shell them until there was nothing left but rubble. That is essentially what the Taliban did to the Binyamin Buddhas. That’d wreck any future for Egypt even more thoroughly than the Arab Spring® already has. Without the ruins, there is no reason for tourists to ever go to Egypt. They have a little agriculture (think Egyptian Cotton), but they’d never be able to make their economy even limp along without tourism.


  163. taxfreekiller
    163 | November 26, 2012 2:10 pm

    Found this on Drudge:
    Pravda (English), Opinion section, “Obama’s Soviet Mistake” by Xavier Lerma, 19.11.2012

    http://english.pravda.ru/opinion/columnist/19-11-2012/122849-obama-soviet-mistake-0/

    The truth hurts, but we may need the pain.


  164. 164 | November 26, 2012 2:15 pm

    @ taxfreekiller:

    We already had a thread on that today :P


  165. lobo91
    165 | November 26, 2012 2:17 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Oh, they could wreck the Sphinx and the Pyramids. If Morsi decided to go that route, they could just drive a few Abrams main battle tanks out there and shell them until there was nothing left but rubble. That is essentially what the Taliban did to the Binyamin Buddhas.

    There’s a big difference between the Buddha statues and the pyramids, though. It’s not that hard to blow up a big vertical stone carving. The pyramids, on the other hand, are massive structures. They could certainly damage the outsides, but they don’t have the technology to get rid of million-ton stone structures like that.


  166. 166 | November 26, 2012 2:23 pm

    @ lobo91:

    No, they don’t have the construction industry to have the equipment to really get rid of the pyramids. But they could wreck them so badly that no one much would be interested in visiting them. For the Islamists’ intents and purposes that would probably be good enough. Everywhere they take power the Islamists do everything they can to increase human misery. I guess if they get a civil war started in Egypt that’ll probably be good enough for their purposes, too.


  167. Daffy Duck
    167 | November 26, 2012 2:24 pm

    @ lobo91:

    While the erection (lol) of the pyramids is still open to debate, I’m certain the quickest way to disassembly would be start at the top with a pry-bar, and let gravity do its magic.


  168. lobo91
    168 | November 26, 2012 2:29 pm

    Daffy Duck wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    While the erection (lol) of the pyramids is still open to debate, I’m certain the quickest way to disassembly would be start at the top with a pry-bar, and let gravity do its magic.

    You’d need an awfully big pry-bar…


  169. Daffy Duck
    169 | November 26, 2012 2:33 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Those blocks aren’t that big. Could definitely be nudged to the edge w/ a pry-bar. Then tuble-down the sides.


  170. lobo91
    170 | November 26, 2012 2:35 pm

    Be vewwy quiet…Leia’s hunting wabbits.

    Unfortunately for her, the wabbit in question is in the park behind my house. It’s sitting there looking at her through the fence like she’s a moron.

    She should probably go back to hunting table scraps…


  171. 171 | November 26, 2012 2:36 pm

    @ lobo91:

    These are Muslims. They’ll do it the old fashion way… Slave labor…

    :evil:


  172. lobo91
    172 | November 26, 2012 2:37 pm

    Daffy Duck wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    Those blocks aren’t that big. Could definitely be nudged to the edge w/ a pry-bar. Then tuble-down the sides.

    They range between 25 and 80 tons each.

    Good luck with that…


  173. lobo91
    173 | November 26, 2012 2:39 pm

    The Great Pyramid consists of an estimated 2.3 million limestone blocks with most believed to have been transported from nearby quarries. The Tura limestone used for the casing was quarried across the river. The largest granite stones in the pyramid, found in the “King’s” chamber, weigh 25 to 80 tonnes and were transported from Aswan, more than 500 miles away. Traditionally, ancient Egyptians cut stone blocks by hammering wooden wedges into the stone which were then soaked with water. As the water was absorbed, the wedges expanded, causing the rock to crack. Once they were cut, they were carried by boat either up or down the Nile River to the pyramid.[15] It is estimated that 5.5 million tons of limestone, 8,000 tons of granite (imported from Aswan), and 500,000 tons of mortar were used in the construction of the Great Pyramid.

    That’s a whole bunch of rock…


  174. Daffy Duck
    174 | November 26, 2012 2:43 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Maybe some regional dialect problems here…pry-bar = pinch-bar, whatever. I’m not refering to the little 12″ device you’d use to pull nails, I’m talking about the 6 to 10 foot long steel bar specifically designed to be used as a lever/fulcrum arrangement and multiply your physical force many times over, specifically so you can move very heavy objects.

    \Look, they got those blocks up there, it would be 100X easier getting them down.


  175. taxfreekiller
    175 | November 26, 2012 2:45 pm

    Good thread, up to Doriengrey’s input on Calif.

    What has got in his bonnet and bit him a stinging hornet or what,,,?

    Is he joking with you or is he that over the top now?

    Calif. is illegal immigrant ground zero, seems he wants to belive the stats the commies put out to hide the truth from him.

    Doriengrey, what gives?

    tfk@ Iron Fist:


  176. lobo91
    176 | November 26, 2012 2:46 pm

    @ Daffy Duck:

    Look, they got those blocks up there, it would be 100X easier getting them down.

    And the people who built it were at least 100 times smarter than the current inhabitants of Egypt, so that’s about right.


  177. 177 | November 26, 2012 2:47 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Hizballah as well is weakened. They have lost 400 fighters in Syria and are watching their backs as Al-Qaeda is now popping up in Lebanon.


  178. RIX
    178 | November 26, 2012 2:47 pm

    Hey I know all about how these pyramids were
    built. They were done by ancient space travelers.
    Seriously,it’s in Von Danikens “Chariots of the gods”,
    which is of course is an accurate historical account.
    They even mated with Earthlings, producing a master
    race as evidenced by Obama.
    It’s all true/


  179. 179 | November 26, 2012 2:48 pm

    @ taxfreekiller:

    It’s Tnesssee’s fault California is bad!
    ////


  180. Storagemanager
    180 | November 26, 2012 2:48 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    I guess if they get a civil war started in Egypt that’ll probably be good enough for their purposes, too.

    Isaiah 19:2 “I will stir up Egyptian against Egyptian—
    brother will fight against brother,
    neighbor against neighbor,
    city against city,
    kingdom against kingdom.


  181. Daffy Duck
    181 | November 26, 2012 2:49 pm

    @ lobo91:

    True.

    @ RIX:

    Ssshhh…Rodan is an ancient alien advocate…


  182. 182 | November 26, 2012 2:50 pm

    @ taxfreekiller:

    I dunno, but I ain’t worring much about it :lol:


  183. RIX
    183 | November 26, 2012 2:51 pm

    @ Daffy Duck:

    @ RIX:

    Ssshhh…Rodan is an ancient alien advocate…

    They walk among us.


  184. 184 | November 26, 2012 2:51 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ taxfreekiller:
    I dunno, but I ain’t worring much about it

    You Marxist hippie!
    /////


  185. 185 | November 26, 2012 2:51 pm

    @ Rodan:

    The more the merrier. If we can get them cutting each other up, the better it is for us.


  186. 186 | November 26, 2012 2:52 pm

    @ Daffy Duck:

    Yeah, I totally believe that.


  187. lobo91
    187 | November 26, 2012 2:52 pm

    RIX wrote:

    @ Daffy Duck:

    @ RIX:

    Ssshhh…Rodan is an ancient alien advocate…

    They walk among us.

    You mean like Nancy Pelosi?


  188. 188 | November 26, 2012 2:54 pm

    @ Rodan:

    I’ve been working on the Marxism thing. It’s teh Way to pick up chix… 8O


  189. RIX
    189 | November 26, 2012 2:55 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    RIX wrote:

    @ Daffy Duck:

    @ RIX:
    Ssshhh…Rodan is an ancient alien advocate…
    They walk among us.

    You mean like Nancy Pelosi?

    An excellent example!All of her people undergo
    full frontal lobotomies.


  190. 190 | November 26, 2012 2:55 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ taxfreekiller:

    It’s Tnesssee’s fault California is bad!
    ////

    Everything would have been just peachy if the shithole people had’ve just stayed in their shithole and not fouled the Golden State. Kinda weird, that was.


  191. RIX
    191 | November 26, 2012 2:55 pm

    Later gators


  192. 192 | November 26, 2012 2:56 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    I bet you went to Harvard! I heard its a nice campus outside of Nashville!


  193. 193 | November 26, 2012 2:57 pm

    @ MacDuff:

    I’m still scratching my head at that.


  194. 194 | November 26, 2012 2:58 pm

    Teh Obama Boom proceedeth apace:

    FXstreet.com (Barcelona) -- From 1.8 in October, the Dallas Fed Manufacturing Business Index was expected to improve to 2.0 in November, but disappointed investors by falling to -2.8.

    There’s nothing more at the link, but I’d say this is bad news for those who were betting Obama’s re-election would kick the economy into overdrive…


  195. lobo91
    195 | November 26, 2012 2:58 pm

    Egypt Mob Strips 3 Girls of Clothes in Cairo’s Tahrir Square

    A mob of about 300 Egyptian youths ripped the clothes off three young women in Cairo’s Tahrir Square today, forcing them to take refuge in a government building, the state-run Ahram Gate reported.

    The youths attempted to force their way into the building, known locally as the Mugamma, after assaulting the women near a downtown Cairo mosque, the website reported.


  196. lobo91
    196 | November 26, 2012 3:00 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    There’s nothing more at the link, but I’d say this is bad news for those who were betting Obama’s re-election would kick the economy into overdrive…

    Maybe if it’s like one of those French tanks with 1 forward and 5 reverse gears…


  197. Lily
    197 | November 26, 2012 3:03 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    In Syria it is Alawite vs. Sunni, isn’t it? And everybody hates the Kurds. And that is just the Near Middle East. In Pakistan it is Taliban (Sunni, right?) vs. Sunni. The same is true to a greater or lesser degree all over the Muslim world. Terrorists and their supporters against Autocrats and their supporters, for the most part.

    And the Arabs look down on the non-Arabs. Then, there’s a hierarchy within the various Arab populations. And of course there are the tribal and clan fights.

    There is basically NO unity within Islam.

    No there isn’t. The muslims of North Africa are being killed or taken as slaves by the Arabs. When they are not killing Christians of South Africa.


  198. taxfreekiller
    198 | November 26, 2012 3:07 pm

    Iron Fist

    Doriengrey needs to review his facts. The dust bowl people are the ones who went west. They were from North Texas Panhandle, Oka, Kansas, and parts of Nebrasks mostly.

    Tenn. mountain people stayed home and made a living making whiskey etal and they had enough to eat as they had the ability to raise their own food.

    Dust bowl areas not so much, all they had was dust and wind.

    Then the think is those where not the ones who voted commie in Calif. it was the kids of the rich locals who f’d up Calif.

    Calif. needs to see itself in a mirror without the fun house thing going on.


  199. 199 | November 26, 2012 3:07 pm

    @ Rodan:

    You? I get back from 5 days off and going through blogging withdrawal and all I can think is WTF?????


  200. Storagemanager
    200 | November 26, 2012 3:10 pm

    Next week the United Nations’ International Telecommunications Union will meet in Dubai to figure out how to control the Internet. Representatives from 193 nations will attend the nearly two week long meeting, according to news reports.Next week the ITU holds a negotiating conference in Dubai, and past months have brought many leaks of proposals for a new treaty. U.S. congressional resolutions and much of the commentary, including in this column, have focused on proposals by authoritarian governments to censor the Internet. Just as objectionable are proposals that ignore how the Internet works, threatening its smooth and open operations,” reports the Wall Street Journal.

    “Having the Internet rewired by bureaucrats would be like handing a Stradivarius to a gorilla. The Internet is made up of 40,000 networks that interconnect among 425,000 global routes, cheaply and efficiently delivering messages and other digital content among more than two billion people around the world, with some 500,000 new users a day
    http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/un-seek-control-internet_664018.html


  201. Lily
    201 | November 26, 2012 3:10 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    People who spend all their time trying to scrounge up enough food to eat don’t have time to take over the world.

    Exactly. In less than a year people will be starving to death in Egypt. Possibly way less than a year. They are net importers of food. Without tourism, they don’t have muh of a way to bring in the money to buy the food. Morsi will give them Shari’ia, but they’ll be starving, too.

    Not to mention in Egypt if or shall I say when it goes to sharia law the landmarks for the reason of their tourism will be gone..because there has already been talk about destroying the pyramids….they will shoot themselves in the foot. They aren’t all that great on taking care of themselves.


  202. Guggi
    202 | November 26, 2012 3:11 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Not an Arab state….

    Austria: Anti-Israel Protesters In Vienna Call For “Death To Jews”… http://weaselzippers.us/2012/11/26/austria-anti-israel-protesters-in-vienna-call-for-death-to-jews/

    I doubt that they are Austrians but asylants from “Palestine”.


  203. 203 | November 26, 2012 3:12 pm

    New Thread.


  204. 204 | November 26, 2012 3:13 pm

    @ Guggi:

    All the more reason to leave them rotting in their native hell-holes. Asylum seekers from Muslim lands don’t (for the most part) come to the West seeking a word free from oppression, but come as colonists bringing that oppression with them.


  205. Guggi
    205 | November 26, 2012 3:14 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    Which isn’t enough to buy food for all their people, but IIRC that is pretty much all military aid, anyway.

    And, because Clinton made Morsi the “guard” of the truce between Israel and Hamas the U.S.A. can’t even withhold the money from them.


  206. 206 | November 26, 2012 3:14 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    You? I get back from 5 days off and going through blogging withdrawal and all I can think is WTF?????

    I have no clue. It didn’t make any sense.


  207. Storagemanager
    207 | November 26, 2012 3:14 pm

    @ taxfreekiller:
    The Grapes of Wrath 1940…very liberal movie about how the government should take care of dust bowl people..


  208. Lily
    208 | November 26, 2012 3:16 pm

    Daffy Duck wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    Maybe some regional dialect problems here…pry-bar = pinch-bar, whatever. I’m not refering to the little 12″ device you’d use to pull nails, I’m talking about the 6 to 10 foot long steel bar specifically designed to be used as a lever/fulcrum arrangement and multiply your physical force many times over, specifically so you can move very heavy objects.

    \Look, they got those blocks up there, it would be 100X easier getting them down.

    Or they could do it the new way they take down things send huge planes into them.
    /////


  209. 209 | November 26, 2012 3:18 pm

    @ Rodan:

    And once again I miss a radio show. Next time check the luggage and make sure at least the iPad is packed.


  210. 210 | November 26, 2012 3:19 pm

    Guggi wrote:

    And, because Clinton made Morsi the “guard” of the truce between Israel and Hamas the U.S.A. can’t even withhold the money from them.

    That is what Obama calls Smart diplomacy… :roll:


  211. Guggi
    211 | November 26, 2012 3:23 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    That is what Obama calls Smart diplomacy…

    Yep. Even the German journalist from Israel called it insane and that was a surprise.


  212. lobo91
    212 | November 26, 2012 3:35 pm

    @ Lily:

    Or they could do it the new way they take down things send huge planes into them.

    Crashing an airliner into the Great Pyramid would barely scratch it.


  213. darkwords
    213 | November 26, 2012 5:32 pm

    @ 114 heysoos: I kind of think the roll out of Islam has changed a lot. It’s asymmetric conversion. Sunnis fund building mosques in the US. The Shia work the Islamophobic angle taking advantage of the Democratic party. The radicals blow stuff up. The flow of dollars preps the battlefield.


  214. darkwords
    214 | November 26, 2012 5:34 pm

    Let’s Clinton visits Syria to reset the wrong of GWB and open up to Damascus. Syria goes into revolution.

    OBama visits Cairo to reset the wrong of GWB and open up to the MB. Egypt goes into revolution.

    There is an Arab Spring, but I think the O admin fuels part of it without a care for the outcome.


  215. 215 | November 27, 2012 11:37 am

    yenta-fada wrote:

    buzzsawmonkey wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    About all Egypt has going for it is a huge population. It’s an economic basket case, and always has been.
    It was considered a wealthy and valuable colony when the Brits had it, wasn’t it? Of course, that was some time ago.

    The Saudis with their oil money took over the power that Egypt used to command in the ME. “Spice” rules the Universe.

    In the books a substitute for “spice” was invented. We’ve got our own coal, nat gas, oil, and nuke power, if we would go ahead and use it.


Back to the Top

The Blogmocracy

website design was Built By David