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A new generation of Republican leaders is set to rise

by Rodan ( 263 Comments › )
Filed under Anarcho-Capitalism, Conservatism, Elections 2012, Elections 2016, Republican Party, Tea Parties, The Political Right at November 27th, 2012 - 3:00 pm

In the wake of the Republican party’s defeat in a  very winnable election, there is much soul searching going on. Some Republicans think everything is fine and dandy and that people just want to mooch. Others realize that the Republican party needs to update its message for the 21st Century. Karl Rove is the face of the old guard. His outdated tactics failed miserable in 2012. His SuperPac spent 300 million and only produced 1 victory. Yet he is still held in his esteem within Republican circles.

A new generation of Republican leaders is emerging. They realize America has changed and that the Republican Party must adapt to this changed environment.  The Republicans have lost the popular vote for President in 5 out of the 6 last presidential elections. Clearly the Party is doing something wrong and an updated message is needed.

In the weeks following the presidential election, a number of prominent conservatives, stunned by the scale of Mitt Romney’s loss, took to the cable-news circuit, offering heterodoxies and heresies designed to save a wounded party.

In other words, the long-overdue moment of Republican reflection has begun. But these are frequently the strategic reflections of veteran party activists, and their solutions have tended to be shortsighted.

If the party desires a return to the White House—and they have only won the popular vote once since 1988—they would be well advised to look to a new generation of conservative writers and intellectuals.

That new generation has for the most part moved beyond battles over whether the top marginal tax rate should be 28 percent or 35 percent; rather, they want to reboot the way Republicans talk to—and think about—the 47 percent.

Multiple Congressmen—Sen. Saxby Chambliss, Rep. Peter King, and Sen. Lindsey Graham—retreated from Grover Norquist’s infamous anti-tax pledge. Republican strategist Mike Murphy advised his fellow conservatives to develop a “view of America that’s not right out of Rush Limbaugh’s dream journal.” Weekly Standard editor William Kristol has told Fox News Sunday viewers that tax hikes on millionaires isn’t a hill Republicans should die on—for three weeks in a row. Even conservative firebrand Sean Hannity claimed to have “evolved” on immigration, seeing it as an issue that has “got to be resolved.”

[....]

Conservative factionalism isn’t going anywhere—the paleos will still do battle with the neocons, who will launch attacks on the libertarians, who in turn will declare war on the social conservatives—but many on the right expect priorities to shift dramatically in the wake of 2012. Republicans had better hope that the Hayekian idea of spontaneous order will work in the post-Romney shakeout, allowing the most sensible views to dominate, and preventing a single clique— those who Carney derisively calls the K Street crowd—from determining the party’s ideological future.

Will the Republican Party adapt its message for the 2010′s? I am personally not hopeful since the Establishment and elements of the base are resistant to change tactics. No strategy to take on the media is being discussed and the Establishment is pushing Jeb Bush. Rick Santorum, who was very disastrous for the party in 2012 is now thinking of running again.   Clearly, the lessons of 2012 are being ignored and it might take another electoral defeat in 2016 for the Republican Party to get its act together. 2020 is the earliest I see another Republican getting elected, but by then it could very well be too late for the country as the Democrats will have us bankrupted this nation.

The Republican party should become the anti-system party. It should position itself as a rebellious cause fighting to overthrow the oppressive regime of the Democrats. The GOP should ba party for Liberation and Freedom. That would be a winning message and a great political strategy. But until the likes of Karl Rove, Grover Norquist,  Jeb Bush and Rick Santorum are neutered, I do not foresee this happening.

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263 Responses to “A new generation of Republican leaders is set to rise”
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  1. 1 | November 27, 2012 3:14 pm

    The GOP needs to hire a Madison Ave. PR firm.


  2. 2 | November 27, 2012 3:17 pm

    Karl Rove needs to be driven out. He is the face for defeat.


  3. Speranza
    3 | November 27, 2012 3:18 pm

    Rove is a puke as is the motley crew he slavishly serves.


  4. Speranza
    4 | November 27, 2012 3:18 pm

    He can take Colin Powell with him.


  5. 5 | November 27, 2012 3:20 pm

    @ Rodan:

    Personally, I’d love to see a late night show a la Letterman/Leno by a conservative host such as Dennis Miller. I know they gave him a late night show before and it didn’t do well, but I’d love to see what would happen if we tried to do media like the MSM and libturds do it.

    David Letterman was beside himself in the runup to the election trying to get Mitt Romney for his show. Mitt continually said “no.” Also, he somehow thought that no matter what he did, his star power was such that Sarah Palin would relent and come on his show. Again, another no.

    Conservatives -- REAL conservatives, that is -- need to step up to the plate as well. Only appear on the conservative show. Paul Ryan, Marco Rubio, Sarah Palin, Allen West, Greg Gutfeld, the new generation of conservatives -- all appearing. And refusing to appear on Letterman so all he has is libturd after libturd (oh, and Bill O’Reilly who’s only looking out for Bill O’Reilly).


  6. 6 | November 27, 2012 3:20 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    Rove is a puke as is the motley crew he slavishly serves.

    The Republicans should go back to their Lincoln roots. we should be the Party of Liberation and freedom. We should not die on a political hill for the rich, many of whom vote for Democrats.


  7. 7 | November 27, 2012 3:21 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    I am reading Greg Gutfeld’s book, the Joy of Hate. he doesn’t just go after the left. he also goes after the Conservatives who have this bitter angry outlook. It’s an awesome book. We need more people like him.


  8. 8 | November 27, 2012 3:22 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    He can take Colin Powell with him.

    I can’t stand that asshole.


  9. heysoos
    9 | November 27, 2012 3:22 pm

    whatever happens, I hope Paul Ryan comes out okay…I like the kid and I’d like to see my dream come true of a conservative from the House winning the POTUS….probably never happen now in our age of AmIdol worship…not enough bling and glamour for the masses of asses


  10. 10 | November 27, 2012 3:24 pm

    @ heysoos:

    VP candidates on losing tickets never end up well. Plus the GOP old guard doesn’t like him.


  11. heysoos
    11 | November 27, 2012 3:24 pm

    I don’t understand the popularity of Palin…goes clean over my head…I think she’s a dunce, hardly fit for any high office


  12. heysoos
    12 | November 27, 2012 3:25 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    VP candidates on losing tickets never end up well. Plus the GOP old guard doesn’t like him.

    the whole idea is to eliminate the old guard imo


  13. 13 | November 27, 2012 3:25 pm

    @ Rodan:

    Did you read his Bible of Unspeakable Truths?


  14. 14 | November 27, 2012 3:26 pm

    @ heysoos:

    Oh oh, you will have incoming now!

    :lol:


  15. John Difool
    15 | November 27, 2012 3:27 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    Speranza wrote:
    He can take Colin Powell with him.
    I can’t stand that asshole.

    Like over 90% of blacks Colin Powell has decided to stand with Obama on the basis melanin content over character & substance even though his policies have been the most destructive to blacks than any other group in this country.

    You would think a man like Powell would be above such things, but sadly no.


  16. 16 | November 27, 2012 3:27 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    VP candidates on losing tickets never end up well. Plus the GOP old guard doesn’t like him.
    the whole idea is to eliminate the old guard imo

    Starting with Karl Rove, he should be target #1. The whole idea of Jeb Bush for 2016 is crazy. Plus that Socialist scumbag Santorum as well. They need to go!


  17. 17 | November 27, 2012 3:28 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Did you read his Bible of Unspeakable Truths?

    No, But I will now.


  18. 18 | November 27, 2012 3:29 pm

    @ Rodan:

    I don’t know. Mondale ran against Reagan, and look how splendidly that worked out… 8O

    Seriously, though, Ryan could be in the hunt next time. Whether he could win or not depends on a lot of thing that are as yet unknown. Second terms rarely work out well, and it is rare that a two term President can just hand it off to the next guy in his Party afterward. Reagan was able to do it, but Clinton couldn’t. We don’t know what 2016 will look like yet, but if I were a betting man I’d bet the second term for Obama will be an utter disaster.


  19. 19 | November 27, 2012 3:29 pm

    @ John Difool:

    Powell is a racist.


  20. heysoos
    20 | November 27, 2012 3:29 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    Oh oh, you will have incoming now!

    good, maybe someone can explain her to me….she’s accomplished zero of any significance, same beef I had with BO


  21. 21 | November 27, 2012 3:30 pm

    @ heysoos:

    She was the best candidate that ran on any ticket in 2008. Period.


  22. John Difool
    22 | November 27, 2012 3:30 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ John Difool:
    Powell is a racist.

    Yep


  23. 23 | November 27, 2012 3:31 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    I’d bet the second term for Obama will be an utter disaster.

    I have no doubt it will be. But if if the GOP runs Jeb Bush, Chris Christie, Rick Santorum or Mike Huckabee we are screwed. I will NOT vote for any of those four.


  24. Speranza
    24 | November 27, 2012 3:32 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    I don’t understand the popularity of Palin…goes clean over my head…I think she’s a dunce, hardly fit for any high office

    She is more of a symbol then anything else. She was governor of Alaska for two years and that was it. She is past her prime and past her time.


  25. Speranza
    25 | November 27, 2012 3:33 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    I’d bet the second term for Obama will be an utter disaster.
    I have no doubt it will be. But if if the GOP runs Jeb Bush, Chris Christie, Rick Santorum or Mike Huckabee we are screwed. I will NOT vote for any of those four.

    Huckabee is full of shit -- he prefers being a “king maker” then actually running. Besides, they can hang Todd Akin around his neck.


  26. John Difool
    26 | November 27, 2012 3:34 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    I’d bet the second term for Obama will be an utter disaster.
    I have no doubt it will be. But if if the GOP runs Jeb Bush, Chris Christie, Rick Santorum or Mike Huckabee we are screwed. I will NOT vote for any of those four.

    Stop donating to the establishment RNC & anyone who thinks this shit is a good idea. I’m convinced more and more these have now become false-flag organizations leftists are pumping money into to get our losing candidates picked for us.


  27. Speranza
    27 | November 27, 2012 3:34 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    She was the best candidate that ran on any ticket in 2008. Period.

    True but that is setting the bar very low.


  28. 28 | November 27, 2012 3:35 pm

    I would like to remind the dumb-ass RINO contingent of the party that in 2008 and 2012 we ran the candidate THEY wanted us to run. Now of course, because the candidate THEY wanted to run has lost, they are looking for a scapegoat to blame it on -- all the while ignoring the fact that this was THEIR candidate. They wanted McCain. They wanted Romney. They got both. Of course, these twits will always say that it was Sarah Palin and Paul Ryan that cost them the election, which is complete and utter horse puckey -- if anything those choice gave some conservative validation to the ticket and kept the relection from being butt kickings.

    Time to step back and let the young conservatives, the ones who understand new and social media -- have a go at winning over the voters. Promise success -- not handouts. And be advised -- Blacks are not overly fond of the idea of amnesty for illegals. Remind them that they are being abandoned by the Demoncraps for a more “lucrative” minority base.


  29. 29 | November 27, 2012 3:36 pm

    @ Rodan:

    Chris Christie I wouldn’t vote for, and Mike Huckabee won’t run, but I am very careful of saying that I simply won’t vote for the Republican candidate. It is laughably unlikely that the Democrat candidate would be preferrable unless I decided that the best solution was secession and I wanted to get the USA down for the count as quickly as possible. I’m sorry, but voting Libertarian isn’t possible. It accomplishes nothing, and it never will. If the Libertarians wanted to be taken seriously, they’d have been trying to elect Congressmen not Presidents.


  30. Speranza
    30 | November 27, 2012 3:37 pm

    I’m convinced that Paul Ryan would have little national appeal as head of the ticket. He is too intellectual and wonkish for this “American Idol” America. The guy will put every one to sleep talking about “Dodd-Frank” and reforming the tax code.


  31. 31 | November 27, 2012 3:38 pm

    @ heysoos:

    Fine. Explain why she’s a dunce.


  32. Speranza
    32 | November 27, 2012 3:39 pm

    Chris Christie is too abrasive and frankly is a phony with his tough guy “Newark, Jersey City” demeanor when in reality he grew up in the tony suburban towns of Livingston and Mendham, N.J.


  33. Speranza
    33 | November 27, 2012 3:40 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:
    All along they had their eye on Jeb Porky Bush and in 15 years from now it will be on George P. Bush. It we had a chance to win in 2012 it was with Romney. Something is wrong with the country.


  34. 34 | November 27, 2012 3:44 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    They got both. Of course, these twits will always say that it was Sarah Palin and Paul Ryan that cost them the election, which is complete and utter horse puckey — if anything those choice gave some conservative validation to the ticket and kept the relection from being butt kickings.

    Both Palin and Ryan kept those losses from being utter routs, McCain especially. Nobody but the Republican “Elites” liked McCain. I remember just before the 2008 election Sean Hannity on his radio show talking about how he’d hate a McCain Administration but an Obama Administration would be ever so much worse, and he was right. You can’t, repeat can not win a Presidential Election without turning out your base very strongly. Romney lost in part because parts of the base wouldn’t vote for a RINO. If Perry hadn’t self-destructed he might could have done better, but he did self-destruct, so probably not. We had a weak field this time around. Things should be stronger in 2016, but the situation will be far more dire. Our debt is already greater than our Gross National Product. It’ll be another third or more larger by 2016. It is highly unlikely that a Republican President with a Republican House and Senate can do more than play King Canute to the tide when it comes to forestalling our collapse. They might be able to buy is more time if the instituted extreme austerity measures, but I don’t see that happening. Certainly the people who voted for Obama in November of this year won’t turn around and vote for Austerity in four years. But they may get sick of 10%+ unemployment by then.


  35. John Difool
    35 | November 27, 2012 3:44 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    Chris Christie is too abrasive and frankly is a phony with his tough guy “Newark, Jersey City” demeanor when in reality he grew up in the tony suburban towns of Livingston and Mendham, N.J.

    He better lose some fucken weight between now & then, guy can’t talk two minutes without getting out of breath so I doubt he’ll make it through an hour & a half debate without getting taken out by the paramedics 30 minutes in.


  36. Guggi
    36 | November 27, 2012 3:45 pm

    Why Republicans should have won the election (and why they didn’t)

    (…)

    Here’s Bolger’s argument in a nutshell (and here’s Austin Powers in a nutshell): If the electorate had looked like 2004, Romney would have won — and perhaps won easily. But, it didn’t. And, it won’t in the future.

    (…)


  37. Speranza
    37 | November 27, 2012 3:46 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    He better lose some fucken weight between now & then, guy can’t talk two minutes without getting out of breath so I doubt he’ll make it through an hour & a half debate without getting taken out by the paramedics 30 minutes in.

    He looks and sounds like he escaped from the cast of the cable TV show “The Sopranos”.


  38. heysoos
    38 | November 27, 2012 3:46 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    Iron Fist wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    She was the best candidate that ran on any ticket in 2008. Period.

    True but that is setting the bar very low.

    very low…like opining up the zoo…same this year…in 2 cycles the GOP managed one retread that might win and he got beat…if the GOP can’t do better they deserve to lose….need new people, young blood, better packaging, smarter planning


  39. 39 | November 27, 2012 3:46 pm

    @ Speranza:

    And that is part of the problem. Anyone that offers a serious solution to our most serious problem will, perforce, be wonkish. And so be boring to people who’d rather be entertained than employed.


  40. 40 | November 27, 2012 3:47 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Bush may very well make it past the primaries.

    But the biggest problem is not going to be Jeb Bush. By 2016, I imagine John Boehner and the rest of the assholes that run the GOP will have pissed off the conservative/TEA Party contingent so much that they are not going to put up with betrayal by these guys any longer. Obama got 7,000,00 fewer votes than he got in 2008; when it came to Romney, conservatives stayed home. Many also stayed home in 2008 and would not, could not pull the lever for McCain.

    Which means third party. I don’t know if they’ll call themselves the Conservative Party, the Constitutional Party, etc., but they are not going to go with what the RINO-GOP serve up -- they put Boehner in power and he shits on them and their candidates every chance he gets. Oh, they’ll be begging for their votes in 2014 -- and that’s where you’ll get the preview to 2016 -- do they give the Republicans what they want or do they basically say EFF YOU.


  41. Speranza
    41 | November 27, 2012 3:48 pm

    If we could have had a combo or Perry’s record as Governor of Texas with Romney’s gravitas and business experience we probably would have won. Alas we did not.


  42. John Difool
    42 | November 27, 2012 3:49 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    John Difool wrote:
    He better lose some fucken weight between now & then, guy can’t talk two minutes without getting out of breath so I doubt he’ll make it through an hour & a half debate without getting taken out by the paramedics 30 minutes in.

    He looks and sounds like he escaped from the cast of the cable TV show “The Sopranos”.

    If someone ticks him off enough at a debate & causes his blood pressure to skyrocket, I can literally see this guy falling over dead at the podium from a massive stroke or coronary.


  43. Speranza
    43 | November 27, 2012 3:50 pm

    Last night Mary Katherine Ham and Juan Williams got into it on the merits of California v. Texas. Of course MKH said she would rather live in Texas any day and Juan Williams kept downplaying the Texas success story. O’Reilly said if you prefer to be on the government dole you would prefer California but if you had any ambition or sense of entrepreneurship you would live in Texas.


  44. heysoos
    44 | November 27, 2012 3:51 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    Fine. Explain why she’s a dunce.

    you know I can’t…I’m not hip enough to all the details…from what I saw during interviews she seemed about as informed as any soccer mom with about the same intellect….hardly a deep thinker and certainly not fit for VP…I have a real problem with people assuming they are fit for office by their narrow standard


  45. Speranza
    45 | November 27, 2012 3:52 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    If someone ticks him off enough at a debate & causes his blood pressure to skyrocket, I can literally see this guy falling over dead at the podium from a massive stroke or coronary.

    Spontaneously combust like one of Spinal Tap’s drummers!


  46. Speranza
    46 | November 27, 2012 3:54 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    you know I can’t…I’m not hip enough to all the details…from what I saw during interviews she seemed about as informed as any soccer mom with about the same intellect….hardly a deep thinker and certainly not fit for VP…I have a real problem with people assuming they are fit for office by their narrow standard

    She had her moments (good and bad) on Fox as a commenter but the one thing that turned me off was once when she was being interviewed by Hannity and within a space of 7 minutes she said “lame stream media” five times and I thought “that is so middle schoolish”.


  47. 47 | November 27, 2012 3:54 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    And that way lies permanent minority status for the Republican Party (at least for however much longer we have). I am not at all sure that that is a threat that the Powers that Be in the Republican Party would care about. I am not at all certain that they wouldn’t rather be the Minority Party in Washington as it is today than the Majority Party in a DC the way the TEA Party will re-make it. They like getting invited to all the right parties more than they want to save the country, if, indeed, they care about the country at all.


  48. heysoos
    48 | November 27, 2012 3:55 pm

    Christie is a one time governor…not ready, not even close…he’s a celebrity at this point, and the GOP has to move away from that trap


  49. 49 | November 27, 2012 3:56 pm

    @ heysoos:

    In other words you bought what the media constructed for you. That was what they hoped for. Palin was a threat to their little order, and so had to be destroyed. Would she have been a good VP? Better than Plugs Biden, that is for certain.


  50. Speranza
    50 | November 27, 2012 3:56 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    when it came to Romney, conservatives stayed home. Many also stayed home in 2008 and would not, could not pull the lever for McCain.

    Actually Romney got more votes then McCain did. As for those who sat it out -- F*** them!


  51. heysoos
    51 | November 27, 2012 3:58 pm

    She had her moments (good and bad) on Fox as a commenter but the one thing that turned me off was once when she was being interviewed by Hannity and within a space of 7 minutes she said “lame stream media” five times and I thought “that is so middle schoolish”.

    right, stuff like that…and just like I predicted back then, she drifted off into reality TV, strung her admirers out with that stupid bus tour, wrote a book made some money….she’s a twit, a celebrity, and poison to any responsible ticket


  52. John Difool
    52 | November 27, 2012 3:59 pm

    Chris Christie most likely has fallen under the spell that he fostered a lot of goodwill with the left & the media over his supposed non-partisan embracing of Obama days before the election.

    If he runs & manages to get the nomination the media will gut him & send him to the slaughterhouse the first chance they get.


  53. waldensianspirit
    53 | November 27, 2012 3:59 pm

    Romney got less of the Mormon vote than Bush did


  54. heysoos
    54 | November 27, 2012 4:00 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    In other words you bought what the media constructed for you. That was what they hoped for. Palin was a threat to their little order, and so had to be destroyed. Would she have been a good VP? Better than Plugs Biden, that is for certain.

    I don’t follow the media and don’t do constructions…you have me confused with somebody else


  55. 55 | November 27, 2012 4:00 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    But the conservatives are done. If all the Republicans are going to do is say “vote for us” and then when they get elected say “well, we’re caving, there’s nothing we can do and you conservatives can pound sand, you’re nothing but trouble” then yes, they will be a minority party.


  56. Speranza
    56 | November 27, 2012 4:03 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    right, stuff like that…and just like I predicted back then, she drifted off into reality TV, strung her admirers out with that stupid bus tour, wrote a book made some money….she’s a twit, a celebrity, and poison to any responsible ticket

    She will never run for public office again. If you really want to see Palin worship go over to “Hot Air”.


  57. 57 | November 27, 2012 4:03 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    I agree -- she’s a personality -- she’s not RUNNING for anything -- but by all means let’s keep insulting her.


  58. bluliner10
    58 | November 27, 2012 4:03 pm

    A lot of the keys for 2014 and 2016 will be somehow wrestling the Senate away from the Donks and continuing to hold the Congress.


  59. Speranza
    59 | November 27, 2012 4:04 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    Chris Christie most likely has fallen under the spell that he fostered a lot of goodwill with the left & the media over his supposed non-partisan embracing of Obama days before the election.
    If he runs & manages to get the nomination the media will gut him & send him to the slaughterhouse the first chance they get.

    Heh just like they did with John”Maverick” McCain four years ago.


  60. Speranza
    60 | November 27, 2012 4:04 pm

    waldensianspirit wrote:

    Romney got less of the Mormon vote than Bush did

    I doubt the Mormon vote is monolithic.


  61. texasam7
    61 | November 27, 2012 4:04 pm

    @ Iron Fist@ Iron Fist:
    Up here, it took well over a decade for the Conservative Party to first ditch the “Progressive” Conservative Party, then go to a regional power under the Reform banner to finally win the federal election with Stephen Harper. I don’t know if the U.S. has that kind of time, and what kind of catastrophe it will take get someone to pull the chute on the Repubican Party as it is today. If you want a frame of reference, in 1993 the Progressive Conservative Party went from majority status to just 2 seats in the Commons.


  62. RIX
    62 | November 27, 2012 4:05 pm

    Here is the problem. This mornings Chicago Tribune published a
    poll. It found that 60% of yoots want bigger government!
    That’s the under 30 crowd & they want more stuff.
    They know that the Dems are the party of getting other peoples
    stuff.


  63. Daffy Duck
    63 | November 27, 2012 4:06 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    Well said, and I am probably one of those who will say “EFF YOU” since I think that is what the Republican Establishment has been saying to me for many election cycles now.


  64. Speranza
    64 | November 27, 2012 4:06 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    A lot of the keys for 2014 and 2016 will be somehow wrestling the Senate away from the Donks and continuing to hold the Congress.

    That would’ve been a lot easier had we run better candidates in (you know the list -- DE, NV, MO. etc.). We really sot ourselves in the foot.


  65. Speranza
    65 | November 27, 2012 4:07 pm

    RIX wrote:

    Here is the problem. This mornings Chicago Tribune published a
    poll. It found that 60% of yoots want bigger government!
    That’s the under 30 crowd & they want more stuff.
    They know that the Dems are the party of getting other peoples
    stuff.

    Not surprised at all. We also need to redefine ourselves not as “the party of small government” but as “the party of efficient government”.


  66. 66 | November 27, 2012 4:08 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Hey maybe the Democrats will nominate Charles Johnson and he will save America!

    :lol:


  67. bluliner10
    67 | November 27, 2012 4:08 pm

    @ Speranza:
    Texas wins hands down.


  68. Speranza
    68 | November 27, 2012 4:08 pm

    @ RIX:
    Wait until the yoots that voted for Obama find out 4 -- 8 years from now they are still stuck in dead end jobs or are unemployed/underemployed, cannot pay off their massive student loans, and are still living at home.


  69. 69 | November 27, 2012 4:09 pm

    @ Daffy Duck:

    Short memory span by those clowns -- or do they remember what happened to them in 2006 when the libertarians said “screw this -- I’m not voting for you this go-round?”


  70. RIX
    70 | November 27, 2012 4:09 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Not surprised at all. We also need to redefine ourselves not as “the party of small government” but as “the party of efficient government”

    .

    That’s exactly right. Plant the seed that the Republican Party is home to smart people.


  71. Speranza
    71 | November 27, 2012 4:10 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Texas wins hands down.

    It is not even close. I would also rather live in Tennessee, South Carolina, or Wyoming over the Golden State.


  72. RIX
    72 | November 27, 2012 4:11 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    @ RIX:
    Wait until the yoots that voted for Obama find out 4 — 8 years from now they are still stuck in dead end jobs or are unemployed/underemployed, cannot pay off their massive student loans, and are still living at home.

    But they will still have their LGF accounts!


  73. 73 | November 27, 2012 4:11 pm

    @ RIX:

    That is due to the Republicans adbandoning younger voters the last 20 years. The Democrats have actively sought out younger voters. When a group only hears one side, that is the the ideals they adopt.

    That is why the GOP needs to run on Liberation from Democratic oppression. Plus, the message of small government is not appealing. Running on more efficient government is a better selling point.


  74. Speranza
    74 | November 27, 2012 4:11 pm

    RIX wrote:

    That’s exactly right. Plant the seed that the Republican Party
    is home to smart people.

    Too many people associate the government with a social safety net. We need to tweak our message.


  75. 75 | November 27, 2012 4:11 pm

    @ Speranza:

    I agree, reality will hit. Will the GOP take advantage of this? I don’t know.


  76. waldensianspirit
    76 | November 27, 2012 4:12 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    I doubt the Mormon vote is monolithic.

    They didn’t before for Bush either


  77. 77 | November 27, 2012 4:12 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Not being scolds would help.


  78. Speranza
    78 | November 27, 2012 4:12 pm

    That’s exactly right. Plant the seed that the Republican Party is home to smart people.

    and cool/hip people too! People who like to enjoy the best things in life and do not worship poverty.


  79. Speranza
    79 | November 27, 2012 4:13 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Not being scolds would help.

    Tell me about it!


  80. 80 | November 27, 2012 4:13 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    A lot of the keys for 2014 and 2016 will be somehow wrestling the Senate away from the Donks and continuing to hold the Congress.

    Message Discipline will be the key. You are a military man and have to admit, the GOP lacks discipline in messaging.


  81. John Difool
    81 | November 27, 2012 4:13 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    waldensianspirit wrote:
    Romney got less of the Mormon vote than Bush did

    I doubt the Mormon vote is monolithic.

    Exactly, why are so many folks under the impression that a shared religion means shared political ideology? It’s as if for some reason folks were under the impression Mormons were really a cult who all vote for Romney like sheep, but forgot a lot of Mormons vote for Harry Reid too.

    You’re average New York Jewish person wouldn’t vote for Eric Cantor for president even though he’s Jewish.


  82. Speranza
    82 | November 27, 2012 4:13 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    I agree, reality will hit. Will the GOP take advantage of this? I don’t know.

    We can but hope. Also the hipsters tend to draw the wrong conclusions. Will they still blame Booosh in 2016?


  83. 83 | November 27, 2012 4:13 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Hedonism is a way to sell Republican ideals.


  84. heysoos
    84 | November 27, 2012 4:14 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    That’s exactly right. Plant the seed that the Republican Party is home to smart people.

    and cool/hip people too! People who like to enjoy the best things in life and do not worship poverty.

    Budweiser!
    the official American made beer of the GOP


  85. bluliner10
    85 | November 27, 2012 4:14 pm

    @ Speranza:
    Hell, I am pretty happy we have a Republican Majority and the 3rd Republican Governor in North Carolina. Even though most of the governors here have been pretty blue dog, Gov Purdue has been a disaster and it will be good to see her gone. Unfortunately, she is from a town 30 miles north of me.


  86. 86 | November 27, 2012 4:14 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Will they still blame Booosh in 2016?

    If Jeb is the nominee, that will not help.


  87. Daffy Duck
    87 | November 27, 2012 4:15 pm

    @ Speranza:

    How about strong conservatives run in democratic primaries (undercover)? Take over their party. They have a solid and low-informed voting block, that will vote for the (D) no matter what, and not really care about the message/issue.


  88. RIX
    88 | November 27, 2012 4:16 pm

    @ Rodan:

    That is why the GOP needs to run on Liberation from Democratic oppression. Plus, the message of small government is not appealing. Running on more efficient government is a better selling point

    That’s right, make it “smart” to be Republican.
    It is an issue to get past the brainwashing of the
    educational system.
    Republican was a hip brand under Reagan, but not since.
    Republicans can’t out hip the Dems, but they can look a
    lot smarter.


  89. Speranza
    89 | November 27, 2012 4:16 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    Exactly, why are so many folks under the impression that a shared religion means shared political ideology? It’s as if for some reason folks were under the impression Mormons were really a cult who all vote for Romney like sheep, but forgot a lot of Mormons vote for Harry Reid too.

    You’re average New York Jewish person wouldn’t vote for Eric Cantor for president even though he’s Jewish.

    1. How many Catholics voted for Obama in PA, Il, NJ, MI, WI, and Ohio?
    2. This Jewish guy voted for Romney but for many NY Jews liberalism is their religion. Many pull the lever for Democrats without even knowing who the hell they are voting for, yet when you talk to them they sound conservative.


  90. 90 | November 27, 2012 4:16 pm

    @ Speranza:

    So would I ….. and I DO live in the Golden State.


  91. John Difool
    91 | November 27, 2012 4:16 pm

    RIX wrote:

    Speranza wrote:
    @ RIX:
    Wait until the yoots that voted for Obama find out 4 — 8 years from now they are still stuck in dead end jobs or are unemployed/underemployed, cannot pay off their massive student loans, and are still living at home.

    But they will still have their LGF accounts!

    They’ve been doing that in Europe for a few decades now & in some places unemployment is actually 20% or over, gas around $10 a gallon but yet they collectively still keep voting for more of the same.

    The Democrats are counting on that here too.


  92. bluliner10
    92 | November 27, 2012 4:16 pm

    @ Rodan:
    Messaging or the message. It is one thing to not have the northeastern liberal republicans on deck, but completely another to have the flyoverstate GOP not coming together to have one coherent and bedrock message.


  93. Storagemanager
    93 | November 27, 2012 4:17 pm

    Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin even had a moon to walk on if the United States had its way in the 1950s?

    During the height of the Cold War, U.S. officials debated whether to detonate nuclear bomb on the moon in order to send a message to the Soviet Union, the Asian News International reports.
    http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/11/26/report-u-s-planned-on-blowing-up-moon-with-nuke-during-cold-war-in-1950s/


  94. RIX
    94 | November 27, 2012 4:18 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Too many people associate the government with a social safety net. We need to tweak our message

    .

    It’s deadly to mess with the social safety net.
    Make the message jobs & your children’s future.


  95. Speranza
    95 | November 27, 2012 4:18 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ RIX:
    That is due to the Republicans adbandoning younger voters the last 20 years. The Democrats have actively sought out younger voters. When a group only hears one side, that is the the ideals they adopt.
    That is why the GOP needs to run on Liberation from Democratic oppression. Plus, the message of small government is not appealing. Running on more efficient government is a better selling point.

    The vote of the “low information voter” is worth just as much as yours and mine. We need all the votes we can get.


  96. Speranza
    96 | November 27, 2012 4:19 pm

    RIX wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Too many people associate the government with a social safety net. We need to tweak our message

    It’s deadly to mess with the social safety net.
    Make the message jobs & your children’s future.

    and optimism. No more of these “culture war” themes.


  97. 97 | November 27, 2012 4:20 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Messaging or the message. It is one thing to not have the northeastern liberal republicans on deck, but completely another to have the flyoverstate GOP not coming together to have one coherent and bedrock message.

    The GOP lacks Discipline, that is one of their weaknesses.


  98. 98 | November 27, 2012 4:21 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Every vote counts.


  99. RIX
    99 | November 27, 2012 4:21 pm

    @ John Difool:

    They’ve been doing that in Europe for a few decades now & in some places unemployment is actually 20% or over, gas around $10 a gallon but yet they collectively still keep voting for more of the same.

    The Democrats are counting on that here too.

    Sure, it’s conditioning & it works.
    Obama gets away with class warfare talking about
    fairness & everybody gets a shot.
    It’s just blather about wealth redistribution.


  100. Speranza
    100 | November 27, 2012 4:22 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    They’ve been doing that in Europe for a few decades now & in some places unemployment is actually 20% or over, gas around $10 a gallon but yet they collectively still keep voting for more of the same.

    The Democrats are counting on that here too.

    A couple of years ago we saw 20 year old French yoots who have never worked a freaking day in their lives rioting because President Sarkozy proposed raising the retirement age in France from 60 to 62 years old and they rioted over something 40 -- 42 years down the road.


  101. RIX
    101 | November 27, 2012 4:23 pm

    @ Speranza:

    and optimism. No more of these “culture war” themes.

    Yup just like Reagan, optimism & a smile.


  102. Speranza
    102 | November 27, 2012 4:23 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Every vote counts.

    Exactly and that includes strippers, rappers, porn stars, etc. We should not turn down any vote.


  103. John Difool
    103 | November 27, 2012 4:23 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    John Difool wrote:
    Exactly, why are so many folks under the impression that a shared religion means shared political ideology? It’s as if for some reason folks were under the impression Mormons were really a cult who all vote for Romney like sheep, but forgot a lot of Mormons vote for Harry Reid too.
    You’re average New York Jewish person wouldn’t vote for Eric Cantor for president even though he’s Jewish.
    1. How many Catholics voted for Obama in PA, Il, NJ, MI, WI, and Ohio?
    2. This Jewish guy voted for Romney but for many NY Jews liberalism is their religion. Many pull the lever for Democrats without even knowing who the hell they are voting for, yet when you talk to them they sound conservative.

    It’s a stupid premise & I wish all the talking heads & wonks would just drop this whole lock-step by religion stuff, it’s ridiculous.

    I’m Catholic & it’s safe to say more Catholics in this country don’t vote the way I do & they won’t vote for Santorum just because he’s Catholic.


  104. RIX
    104 | November 27, 2012 4:23 pm

    Later gators


  105. heysoos
    105 | November 27, 2012 4:24 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Every vote counts.

    sometimes twice…the GOP needs to offer some honest bipartisan election reforms…like a fucking machine that works


  106. 106 | November 27, 2012 4:24 pm

    @ Storagemanager:

    That would have been disasterous for the planet.


  107. Speranza
    107 | November 27, 2012 4:24 pm

    RIX wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    and optimism. No more of these “culture war” themes.
    Yup just like Reagan, optimism & a smile.

    That’s why I don’t want a Rick Santorum being the face of the Republican Party.

    “We are Republicans -- we work hard, we play hard, and we do like sex!”.


  108. 108 | November 27, 2012 4:25 pm

    @ John Difool:

    I am Catholic and will never vote for that Sanctimonous Socialist Santorum.


  109. Speranza
    109 | November 27, 2012 4:25 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    sometimes twice…the GOP needs to offer some honest bipartisan election reforms…like a fucking machine that works

    Quite concur! We need to put a stop to that shit.


  110. 110 | November 27, 2012 4:26 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Santorum should be driven from the Party. Let him go start the Theocratic Socialist Party. I despise him and would love to see someone knock that smirk off his face!


  111. Speranza
    111 | November 27, 2012 4:26 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ John Difool:
    I am Catholic and will never vote for that Sanctimonous Socialist Santorum.

    The *****r *****r got beaten by 16 -18% in 2006. Bleep him, he is a nobody.


  112. John Difool
    112 | November 27, 2012 4:26 pm

    Storagemanager wrote:

    Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin even had a moon to walk on if the United States had its way in the 1950s?
    During the height of the Cold War, U.S. officials debated whether to detonate nuclear bomb on the moon in order to send a message to the Soviet Union, the Asian News International reports.
    http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/11/26/report-u-s-planned-on-blowing-up-moon-with-nuke-during-cold-war-in-1950s/

    Guess you could say…..it would have been…..a Blew Moon.

    *slips on sunglasses*

    YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH !!!!


  113. 113 | November 27, 2012 4:27 pm

    @ heysoos:

    We need a national standard of voting. None of this machine crap, we need real paper ballots.


  114. Speranza
    114 | November 27, 2012 4:28 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Santorum should be driven from the Party. Let him go start the Theocratic Socialist Party. I despise him and would love to see someone knock that smirk off his face!

    Unfortunately the primary system brings him out. If losing so decisively in 2006 could not humble him then nothing will.


  115. John Difool
    115 | November 27, 2012 4:28 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ John Difool:
    I am Catholic and will never vote for that Sanctimonous Socialist Santorum.

    He’s Mike Huckabee with a pope hat on.


  116. 116 | November 27, 2012 4:29 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Karl Rove loves his little fiefdom.


  117. Speranza
    117 | November 27, 2012 4:29 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ John Difool:
    I am Catholic and will never vote for that Sanctimonous Socialist Santorum.

    He’s Mike Huckabee with a pope hat on.

    Huckabee I cannot stand for his being a front man for John McCain in 2008 and advising Akin to continue his quest for the Senate.


  118. 118 | November 27, 2012 4:30 pm

    @ John Difool:

    Huckabee is another Theocratic Socialist. I can respect someone who is Sscially conservative but an Economic Conservative. I can’t stand these Socialist fraudsters that use Social issues to disguise their real agenda.

    Rick Santorum and Mike Huckabee have more in common with Hugo Chavez than they do with Ronald Reagan.


  119. Speranza
    119 | November 27, 2012 4:31 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    Karl Rove loves his little fiefdom.

    “The Architect” as Hannity always refers to him as, is so overrated as a political strategist that anyone foolish enough to give him money might as well just stand on a street corner and hand it out to the bums.


  120. heysoos
    120 | November 27, 2012 4:31 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ heysoos:
    We need a national standard of voting. None of this machine crap, we need real paper ballots.

    I was speaking in metaphore…whatever frikkin works, every time…
    purple thumbs for all I care…this is a needless problem and an embarrassment


  121. John Difool
    121 | November 27, 2012 4:32 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Huck is another populist passionate conservative, the same as Santorum is.

    They would no more cut entitlement spending than Obama would, hell they’d probably increase them even more because that’s what a good Christian would do for their neighbors.


  122. heysoos
    122 | November 27, 2012 4:32 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ John Difool:
    I am Catholic and will never vote for that Sanctimonous Socialist Santorum.

    He’s Mike Huckabee with a pope hat on.

    hahaha!…true enough


  123. 123 | November 27, 2012 4:33 pm

    @ heysoos:

    Agreed!


  124. Speranza
    124 | November 27, 2012 4:34 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Huck is another populist passionate conservative, the same as Santorum is.
    They would no more cut entitlement spending than Obama would, hell they’d probably increase them even more because that’s what a good Christian would do for their neighbors.

    They are purely social conservatives but are statists too. They would be “compassionate conservatives” squared.


  125. 125 | November 27, 2012 4:34 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Huck is another populist passionate conservative, the same as Santorum is.
    They would no more cut entitlement spending than Obama would, hell they’d probably increase them even more because that’s what a good Christian would do for their neighbors.

    They would do it in the name of “the family.”


  126. 126 | November 27, 2012 4:35 pm

    @ Speranza:

    They are just religious Leftists. But too many well meaning people vote for them because they fall for the red meat rhetoric.


  127. Speranza
    127 | November 27, 2012 4:36 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    They are just religious Leftists. But too many well meaning people vote for them because they fall for the red meat rhetoric.

    Yeah as if they can ban abortion by executive diktat.


  128. 128 | November 27, 2012 4:37 pm

    @ Speranza:

    I laugh when I hear Jeb has no chance. He will use Red Meat rhetoric and people in iowa will eat it up! It worked for his father and brother!


  129. John Difool
    129 | November 27, 2012 4:38 pm

    Heres the thing about Santorum, like George Allen, he couldn’t even keep his Senate seat from his own state because they are clueless RINO idiots who just don’t get it. If you want folks to take you seriously go get that seat back or win the governorship of your state.

    Until then, GTFO.

    Seriously, he lost his seat way back in ’06 & has been running for president ever since. Maybe it’s time to get a real job.


  130. 130 | November 27, 2012 4:40 pm

    @ John Difool:

    Maybe it’s time to get a real job.

    :lol: Santorum probably thinks he’s on a holy mission to save America from Abortion, Contraceptives Gays and Capitalism. He wants a Religious Socialist nanny State.


  131. John Difool
    131 | November 27, 2012 4:40 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    I laugh when I hear Jeb has no chance. He will use Red Meat rhetoric and people in iowa will eat it up! It worked for his father and brother!

    He’s counting on winning the Hispanic vote because he’s married to a Mexican woman & speaks Spanish.

    This is what some of the wonks & heads are saying on the right & I’m just shaking my head.


  132. 132 | November 27, 2012 4:43 pm

    @ John Difool:

    He may do better than Romney, but many Libertarian and Economic Conservatives will NOT vote for him. I absolutely refuse to vote for Jeb. I will vote Libertarian or if the Dems nominate Andrew Cuomo, I will vote Dem. Better a Economically Conservative Democrac than a Socialist Republican.


  133. Speranza
    133 | November 27, 2012 4:43 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    He’s counting on winning the Hispanic vote because he’s married to a Mexican woman & speaks Spanish.

    This is what some of the wonks & heads are saying on the right & I’m just shaking my head.

    They are delusional. The Bush name is toxic.


  134. Speranza
    134 | November 27, 2012 4:44 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    I laugh when I hear Jeb has no chance. He will use Red Meat rhetoric and people in iowa will eat it up! It worked for his father and brother!

    He cannot run from his last name.


  135. 135 | November 27, 2012 4:45 pm

    @ Speranza:

    The ones voting for the first time in 2014 have known nothing but American Idol and Dancing with the Stars and Jon Stewart for all of their cognitive lives. Frankly, many, if not MOST of them are ignorant of current affairs to vote with any kind of reason.

    The fact that women voted for Obama because they thought Romney was going to take their right to an abortion away (which is disgusting to me on so many levels) tells me that these twits had no idea what Roe v. Wade really said.


  136. John Difool
    136 | November 27, 2012 4:46 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    John Difool wrote:
    He’s counting on winning the Hispanic vote because he’s married to a Mexican woman & speaks Spanish.
    This is what some of the wonks & heads are saying on the right & I’m just shaking my head.

    They are delusional. The Bush name is toxic.

    I was just getting to say that in response to Rodan, the Bush name is almost as toxic on the right as it is on the left now.

    The establishment GOP is totally tone-deaf & as usual really doesn’t get it.


  137. Speranza
    137 | November 27, 2012 4:50 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    I was just getting to say that in response to Rodan, the Bush name is almost as toxic on the right as it is on the left now.

    The establishment GOP is totally tone-deaf & as usual really doesn’t get it.

    They are loathsome.


  138. Speranza
    138 | November 27, 2012 4:53 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    The ones voting for the first time in 2014 have known nothing but American Idol and Dancing with the Stars and Jon Stewart for all of their cognitive lives. Frankly, many, if not MOST of them are ignorant of current affairs to vote with any kind of reason.
    The fact that women voted for Obama because they thought Romney was going to take their right to an abortion away (which is disgusting to me on so many levels) tells me that these twits had no idea what Roe v. Wade really said.

    And that is why they are referred to as “low information voters” but we also have them on the Right as well. There really are people who think that the POTUS can outlaw abortion. Duh he can’t and wouldn’t (and that includes a Republican) even if he could


  139. John Difool
    139 | November 27, 2012 4:53 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    John Difool wrote:
    I was just getting to say that in response to Rodan, the Bush name is almost as toxic on the right as it is on the left now.
    The establishment GOP is totally tone-deaf & as usual really doesn’t get it.
    They are loathsome.

    We are just a few weeks past the last election & 2016 is already pretty much screwed thanks to the same cast of characters.


  140. Speranza
    140 | November 27, 2012 4:53 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Hedonism is a way to sell Republican ideals.

    I agree.


  141. Speranza
    141 | November 27, 2012 4:55 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Hell, I am pretty happy we have a Republican Majority and the 3rd Republican Governor in North Carolina. Even though most of the governors here have been pretty blue dog, Gov Purdue has been a disaster and it will be good to see her gone. Unfortunately, she is from a town 30 miles north of me.

    Bev Purdue not running (actually I was hoping she would run and get creamed) was one of the few good news stories this month.


  142. 142 | November 27, 2012 4:55 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    The fact that women voted for Obama because they thought Romney was going to take their right to an abortion away (which is disgusting to me on so many levels) tells me that these twits had no idea what Roe v. Wade really said.

    We can thank Santorum for this. He gave the Democrats ammo.


  143. Speranza
    143 | November 27, 2012 4:56 pm

    Daffy Duck wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    How about strong conservatives run in democratic primaries (undercover)? Take over their party. They have a solid and low-informed voting block, that will vote for the (D) no matter what, and not really care about the message/issue.

    Good luck with that!


  144. Speranza
    144 | November 27, 2012 4:57 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    We are just a few weeks past the last election & 2016 is already pretty much screwed thanks to the same cast of characters.

    Nah better we get the poison out in the open now.


  145. 145 | November 27, 2012 4:58 pm

    @ Speranza:

    How many states would a Jeb Bush-Rick Santorum ticket lose? I say they lose 40-45 states.


  146. John Difool
    146 | November 27, 2012 4:59 pm

    Go over to Zero Hedge right now if you want to read some really scary stuff.

    Either the student loan bubble just popped or it will in a few short weeks. This really going to be a death knell for the stock market & economy.

    A friend of mine who’s wife is in school right now just had her student loans cut off with no explanation given. I wonder how many other folks this has just happened to?

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-11-27/scariest-chart-quarter-student-debt-bubble-officially-pops-90-day-delinquency-rate-g


  147. John Difool
    147 | November 27, 2012 5:00 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:
    The fact that women voted for Obama because they thought Romney was going to take their right to an abortion away (which is disgusting to me on so many levels) tells me that these twits had no idea what Roe v. Wade really said.
    We can thank Santorum for this. He gave the Democrats ammo.

    Yep, & Akin too.


  148. 148 | November 27, 2012 5:00 pm

    @ Speranza:

    The Democrat Machine is even worse for Conservative Democrats than it is for Conservative Republicans. If a Conservative wins the Primary, they won’t contest the seat. That happened here in Tennessee this year for Senate, and the Dems just didn’t bother with it.


  149. bluliner10
    149 | November 27, 2012 5:01 pm

    @ Speranza:
    Yes, seeing Purdue (we’re just like Mississippi y’all) defeated would have been awesome. As it was, watching her LtGov get smoked was pretty awesome too. Little heard was the LtGov race which was also taken by a Republican. Not quite a supermajority, but it is time to take some more work from Virginia.


  150. heysoos
    150 | November 27, 2012 5:04 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ John Difool:
    Maybe it’s time to get a real job.
    Santorum probably thinks he’s on a holy mission to save America from Abortion, Contraceptives Gays and Capitalism. He wants a Religious Socialist nanny State.

    yup…turns me off bigtime…it’s not his belief, it’s about shoving it in my face


  151. lobo91
    151 | November 27, 2012 5:08 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:

    That would have been disasterous for the planet.

    What an utterly ridiculous story.

    Detonating a nuke on the surface of the moon would have done very little to it, other than raising a dust cloud and making a small crater.


  152. 152 | November 27, 2012 5:09 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ John Difool:

    Maybe it’s time to get a real job.

    Santorum probably thinks he’s on a holy mission to save America from Abortion, Contraceptives Gays and Capitalism. He wants a Religious Socialist nanny State.

    He gives Catholics a bad name.


  153. bluliner10
    153 | November 27, 2012 5:10 pm

    @ MacDuff:
    Joe Biden and John Kerry give Catholics a bad name. Rick Santorum just isn’t helping.


  154. John Difool
    154 | November 27, 2012 5:11 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Storagemanager:
    That would have been disasterous for the planet.

    What an utterly ridiculous story.
    Detonating a nuke on the surface of the moon would have done very little to it, other than raising a dust cloud and making a small crater.

    I know, it’s not like the moon hasn’t been impacted by large meteors & asteroids that were way more powerful than nukes or anything….


  155. 155 | November 27, 2012 5:13 pm

    I think we should eviscerate another goat and read it’s entrails.

    Not even 30 days after the election and I am so sick of this shit already I could puke. All I hear discussed is tactics. The only time I hear a discussion of principles is when somebody suggests we drop them like a hot potato.


  156. lobo91
    156 | November 27, 2012 5:13 pm

    @ John Difool:

    I know, it’s not like the moon hasn’t been impacted by large meteors & asteroids that were way more powerful than nukes or anything….

    You’d think the craters would be a giveaway…


  157. lobo91
    157 | November 27, 2012 5:14 pm

    @ Mike C.:

    All I hear discussed is tactics. The only time I hear a discussion of principles is when somebody suggests we drop them like a hot potato.

    You’ve noticed that too, huh?


  158. 158 | November 27, 2012 5:15 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ MacDuff:
    Joe Biden and John Kerry give Catholics a bad name. Rick Santorum just isn’t helping.

    I’m not the arbiter of anyone’s Catholicism, but I, personally, don’t consider them Catholics. But that’s just me.


  159. 159 | November 27, 2012 5:15 pm

    heysoos wrote:

    Speranza wrote:
    That’s exactly right. Plant the seed that the Republican Party is home to smart people.

    and cool/hip people too! People who like to enjoy the best things in life and do not worship poverty.

    Budweiser!
    the official American made beer of the GOP

    Oh noes! But I drink Coors Light. And Yes, I know -- that joke just writes itself.

    Libturds to me always drink a beer that allows them to stuff a slice of something citrus down the neck.


  160. John Difool
    160 | November 27, 2012 5:19 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    They always drink something pretentious & pricey that tastes like shit. It’s as if the price & a fancy ironic name or label makes a good beer these days.

    If I’m gonna drink something that tastes like shit it’s gonna be cheap.


  161. 161 | November 27, 2012 5:21 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Libturds to me always drink a beer that allows them to stuff a slice of something citrus down the neck.

    I hate the slice of lime in my bottle, it inhibits the free flow of beer.


  162. taxfreekiller
    162 | November 27, 2012 5:21 pm

    Ted Cruz.


  163. 163 | November 27, 2012 5:23 pm

    @ lobo91:

    So It’s just sensationalist hogwash then? That’s what it sounded like.


  164. 164 | November 27, 2012 5:23 pm

    taxfreekiller wrote:

    Ted Cruz.

    Future member of the Supreme Court!


  165. lobo91
    165 | November 27, 2012 5:24 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    So It’s just sensationalist hogwash then? That’s what it sounded like.

    You say that like you’re surprised…


  166. 166 | November 27, 2012 5:24 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ MacDuff:
    Joe Biden and John Kerry give Catholics a bad name. Rick Santorum just isn’t helping.

    Joe Biden gives humans a bad name. He clearly has had a mental breakdown. He shiould be in a mental ward.


  167. 167 | November 27, 2012 5:25 pm

    @ lobo91:

    I’m surprise anyone even published that story.


  168. lobo91
    168 | November 27, 2012 5:26 pm

    Naked protesters occupy Boehner’s office to protest “cuts” in AIDS funding. Never mind that there haven’t been, and probably aren’t going to be, any such cuts. Facts are irrelevant (and probably homophobic):


  169. 169 | November 27, 2012 5:27 pm

    @ John Difool:

    Yes indeed -- and Coors Lite, the official beer of NASCAR (and doesn’t even sponsor a car) is cheap and crappy -- two beers in one!!


  170. lobo91
    170 | November 27, 2012 5:27 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    I’m surprise anyone even published that story.

    Why? Do you think anyone at that CBS station ever took a science course?


  171. 171 | November 27, 2012 5:28 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    I’m surprise anyone even published that story.

    I don’t think we could have put an object on the moon in the 50s if our lives depended on it. We just didn’t have the technology.


  172. 172 | November 27, 2012 5:28 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Do you think anyone at that CBS station ever took a science course?

    Sure, on Global Warming!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    :lol:


  173. 173 | November 27, 2012 5:29 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Instead of spending 10 bucks, Boehner wanted to spend 9. That is their definition of a cut!


  174. John Difool
    174 | November 27, 2012 5:29 pm

    @ lobo91:

    They should be in front of the WH since Obama has cut AIDS funding by hundreds of millions of dollars in his first term but as usual libtards are idiots.


  175. 175 | November 27, 2012 5:33 pm

    @ John Difool:

    Romney gets to shoulder some blame for this as well.
    Let’s all remember that debate where George Stephanopolous, no doubt on marching orders from the Obama White House, asked that ridiculous birth control question, and Romney, et al., instead of saying “Birth control? Are you kidding? This is not an issue in this campaign, Mr. Stephanopolous -- and I’m offended you’re trying to make it one.”

    Which brings me to point no. 2. Will you clowns running the GOP acknowledge that the goddamned mainstream media is NOT on your side, is NOT goint to present your candidates fairly and therefore should NEVER be allowed anywhere near a Republican-only debate. Fox and only Fox should broadcast them. If they mainstream media asks why, tell them “considering your bias in the 2012 Presidential debates, we’ve decided that the little you host debates, the better.


  176. John Difool
    176 | November 27, 2012 5:33 pm

    MacDuff wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ lobo91:
    I’m surprise anyone even published that story.

    I don’t think we could have put an object on the moon in the 50s if our lives depended on it. We just didn’t have the technology.

    And even if we could have, how would they have detonated it since just about all nuke bombs & missiles then (to my knowledge) worked off of a barometric trigger?


  177. 177 | November 27, 2012 5:33 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    @ lobo91:
    They should be in front of the WH since Obama has cut AIDS funding by hundreds of millions of dollars in his first term but as usual libtards are idiots.

    They will not go after their god-king!


  178. taxfreekiller
    178 | November 27, 2012 5:34 pm

    Student loan debt is not dischargeable in bankruptcy except in extreme cases (total diabled car wreck ect), and in many cases the parents have co-signed.

    50% of law school grads from last year do not have jobs and many of them owe like $50,000 to $100,000 ie Harvard on student loans.

    Many voted for Obama, but looks like he can not print money fast enough and our boat is sinking via the borrowering hole in the bottom.


  179. 179 | November 27, 2012 5:34 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    For 2016, They should not agree to let people like Stephanopolous and Candy Crowley moderate.


  180. lobo91
    180 | November 27, 2012 5:37 pm

    MacDuff wrote:

    Rodan wrote:

    @ lobo91:

    I’m surprise anyone even published that story.

    I don’t think we could have put an object on the moon in the 50s if our lives depended on it. We just didn’t have the technology.

    The Soviets first landed an object on the moon in 1959 (Luna 2). We first did it in 1962 (Ranger 4).

    Both were in the 600-800 pound range, which is heavy enough to have been replaced by a small nuke.


  181. 181 | November 27, 2012 5:39 pm

    @ heysoos:

    I have a problem with Santorum for that reason. I don’t like morality being preached to me by anyone. I can make up my own mind for right and wrong. He also came across as a “scold” to me and frankly, I’m 59 years old and I don’t need anyone telling me how to think.

    And What I really don’t need is a 51 year-old man who’s never worked a day in his life that spends my tax dollars by the billions to buy shit for his free stuff followers telling me my wealth needs to be spread around -- mostly on clothes to cover his wife’s fat ass.


  182. 182 | November 27, 2012 5:41 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    The Soviets first landed an object on the moon in 1959 (Luna 2). We first did it in 1962 (Ranger 4).

    Both were in the 600-800 pound range, which is heavy enough to have been replaced by a small nuke.

    Well, I guess I stand corrected.


  183. lobo91
    183 | November 27, 2012 5:46 pm

    MacDuff wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    The Soviets first landed an object on the moon in 1959 (Luna 2). We first did it in 1962 (Ranger 4).

    Both were in the 600-800 pound range, which is heavy enough to have been replaced by a small nuke.

    Well, I guess I stand corrected.

    If all you care about is hitting the moon with an object, it’s not that complicated. You just need a big-ass rocket and a slide rule to figure out when to launch it, since it takes a couple of days to get there. :)


  184. 184 | November 27, 2012 5:47 pm

    @ lobo91:

    My problem with all the protests regarding AIDS funding is that unless you are a hemophiliac or a blood recipient you’ve known for 30 years how AIDS is spread and would have been in a position to avoid it. If you’ve been sharing needles, “riding bareback” and otherwise engaging in behavior that gave you this disease, then frankly I don’t have a lot of sympathy for you. And sorry, but I remember the gays in S.F. not wanting to close the bathhouses when Don Francis recommended it, saying that to do so infringed on their “freedom.”

    I don’t see women barricading themselves inside of offices demanding further research for breast or ovarian cancer, or heart disease; I don’t see men occupying offices for more money for prostate cancer. I’m sick of this little twits thinking that somehow AIDS is so damn special in this day and age and the failure to find a cure is everybody else’s fault.


  185. huckfunn
    185 | November 27, 2012 5:48 pm

    taxfreekiller wrote:

    Student loan debt is not dischargeable in bankruptcy except in extreme cases (total diabled car wreck ect), and in many cases the parents have co-signed.

    50% of law school grads from last year do not have jobs and many of them owe like $50,000 to $100,000 ie Harvard on student loans.

    Many voted for Obama, but looks like he can not print money fast enough and our boat is sinking via the borrowering hole in the bottom.

    Look at that chart in John Difool’s #146. As soon as Obatomy won the election the delinquent rate on student loans spiked as if many of them were saying “Gee, Obama’s gonna be Prezzy again. I don’t have to pay back my loan”. They could be right. Obama could just issue an executive fatwah declaring all student loans are forgiven, null and and void.


  186. taxfreekiller
    186 | November 27, 2012 5:48 pm

    Who gonna keep the Govt’ments printing presses cooled down?


  187. Speranza
    187 | November 27, 2012 5:49 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    I don’t see women barricading themselves inside of offices demanding further research for breast or ovarian cancer, or heart disease;

    You sure don’t.


  188. lobo91
    188 | November 27, 2012 5:49 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    I agree 100%.

    The only reason anyone cares is because it primarily affects gays.


  189. 189 | November 27, 2012 5:50 pm

    From Weasel Zippers -- some whimsical factoids to get you in the holiday mood -- I’m sorry -- the CHRISTMAS SPIRIT.

    Take your “Happy Holidays” and shove it. Finally, there’s proof that Americans prefer “Merry Christmas.”

    By a wide margin, 68 percent to 23 percent, Americans prefer stores with signs that say “Merry Christmas” during the Christmas holidays than the more generic and secular “Happy Holidays,” according to a new Rasmussen Reports survey.

    A few examples:

    – Among men, it’s 69 percent for “Merry Christmas,” compared to 22 percent for “Happy Holiday.”

    – Women: 67 percent to 23 percent.

    – Whites: 69 percent to 20 percent.

    – Blacks: 56 percent to 40 percent.

    – Republicans: 86 percent to 8 percent.

    – Democrats: 51 percent to 41 percent.


  190. taxfreekiller
    190 | November 27, 2012 5:51 pm

    The Fed will sell Student Loan Bonds to any dumb smuck who will buy them and “We The People” are the cattle aka colrattleing parts, aka the stuff put up at the Ones of Chinas Pawn Shop.@ huckfunn:


  191. Speranza
    191 | November 27, 2012 5:51 pm

    bluliner10 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Yes, seeing Purdue (we’re just like Mississippi y’all) defeated would have been awesome. As it was, watching her LtGov get smoked was pretty awesome too. Little heard was the LtGov race which was also taken by a Republican. Not quite a supermajority, but it is time to take some more work from Virginia.

    We have to liberate Virginia.


  192. lobo91
    192 | November 27, 2012 5:51 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    Obama could just issue an executive fatwah declaring all student loans are forgiven, null and and void.

    Not unless he plans to write a check to cover them, he can’t.

    Most student loans are issued by banks and guaranteed by the government, much like VA mortgages.

    Forgiving them means the government has to pay them off.


  193. John Difool
    193 | November 27, 2012 5:54 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    The thing is, noone to my knowledge was talking about cutting off funding for AIDS research, they were talking about cutting entitlements not grants.

    No doubt this is another stunt from a Soros funded leftist group disguised as grass roots.


  194. Speranza
    194 | November 27, 2012 5:54 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:
    For 2016, They should not agree to let people like Stephanopolous and Candy Crowley moderate.

    They should insist on either Bret Baier, Brit Hume or Chris Wallace.


  195. lobo91
    195 | November 27, 2012 5:55 pm

    @ John Difool:

    The thing is, noone to my knowledge was talking about cutting off funding for AIDS research, they were talking about cutting entitlements not grants.

    Obama and Reid aren’t talking about cutting anything except defense spending.


  196. Speranza
    196 | November 27, 2012 5:56 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    My problem with all the protests regarding AIDS funding is that unless you are a hemophiliac or a blood recipient you’ve known for 30 years how AIDS is spread and would have been in a position to avoid it. If you’ve been sharing needles, “riding bareback” and otherwise engaging in behavior that gave you this disease, then frankly I don’t have a lot of sympathy for you. And sorry, but I remember the gays in S.F. not wanting to close the bathhouses when Don Francis recommended it, saying that to do so infringed on their “freedom.”

    Whatever happened to that great “rapid breakout of AIDS into the heterosexual community” they were so hopefully predicting back in 1985?


  197. yenta-fada
    197 | November 27, 2012 5:56 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:

    I agree — she’s a personality — she’s not RUNNING for anything — but by all means let’s keep insulting her.

    LOL. If I were on facebook, I would sooo ‘friend’ you.


  198. 198 | November 27, 2012 5:57 pm

    By the way, lest my Jewish friends think I am a Santa-centric little twit, I say “Happy Hannukah” in the same breath until the holiday is over (I think December 16th this year, right?).


  199. Speranza
    199 | November 27, 2012 5:57 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:
    What about Happy Ram-a-dam-a-ding-dong?


  200. lobo91
    200 | November 27, 2012 5:57 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Whatever happened to that great “rapid breakout of AIDS into the heterosexual community” they were so hopefully predicting back in 1985?

    It’s in the same secret warehouse as Romney’s 330 electoral votes…


  201. Speranza
    201 | November 27, 2012 5:58 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    By the way, lest my Jewish friends think I am a Santa-centric little twit, I say “Happy Hannukah” in the same breath until the holiday is over (I think December 16th this year, right?).

    The funny thing is that Hannukah was always a minor holiday until the 1940′s and 50′s when it was pushed so that little Jewish kids such as moi would not feel left out.


  202. lobo91
    202 | November 27, 2012 5:58 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:
    What about Happy Ram-a-dam-a-ding-dong?

    Ramadan was in August this year.


  203. Speranza
    203 | November 27, 2012 5:59 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Whatever happened to that great “rapid breakout of AIDS into the heterosexual community” they were so hopefully predicting back in 1985?

    It’s in the same secret warehouse as Romney’s 330 electoral votes…

    Dick Morris has them in a “lock box”.
    Actually I was thinking more along the lines of those “shovel ready” jobs.


  204. yenta-fada
    204 | November 27, 2012 5:59 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    The ‘specialness’ of AIDS research dovetails with Buzz’s theory of pushing the gay agenda aka human rights in order to replace actual civil rights.


  205. lobo91
    205 | November 27, 2012 6:00 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Whatever happened to that great “rapid breakout of AIDS into the heterosexual community” they were so hopefully predicting back in 1985?

    It’s in the same secret warehouse as Romney’s 330 electoral votes…

    Dick Morris has them in a “lock box”.
    Actually I was thinking more along the lines of those “shovel ready” jobs.

    It’s a big warehouse.


  206. 206 | November 27, 2012 6:00 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    They should insist on either Bret Baier, Brit Hume or Chris Wallace.

    In all honesty, those three are very impressive journalists and they get little respect because they work for Fox.


  207. Speranza
    207 | November 27, 2012 6:00 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Speranza wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:
    What about Happy Ram-a-dam-a-ding-dong?

    Ramadan was in August this year.

    Yes I know, I have a Turkish co-worker who observes it.


  208. lobo91
    208 | November 27, 2012 6:01 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:

    Speranza wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:
    What about Happy Ram-a-dam-a-ding-dong?

    Ramadan was in August this year.

    Yes I know, I have a Turkish co-worker who observes it.

    You don’t get the full effect until you’ve experienced it in a Muslim country.


  209. John Difool
    209 | November 27, 2012 6:02 pm

    huckfunn wrote:

    taxfreekiller wrote:
    Student loan debt is not dischargeable in bankruptcy except in extreme cases (total diabled car wreck ect), and in many cases the parents have co-signed.
    50% of law school grads from last year do not have jobs and many of them owe like $50,000 to $100,000 ie Harvard on student loans.
    Many voted for Obama, but looks like he can not print money fast enough and our boat is sinking via the borrowering hole in the bottom.

    Look at that chart in John Difool’s #146. As soon as Obatomy won the election the delinquent rate on student loans spiked as if many of them were saying “Gee, Obama’s gonna be Prezzy again. I don’t have to pay back my loan”. They could be right. Obama could just issue an executive fatwah declaring all student loans are forgiven, null and and void.

    Yes, funny that. Like I said in that post, a friend of mines wife has had her loans cut off with no explanation.

    My guess is, this is happening all over the country right now & the money will be cut off until the Fed guarantees a bail-out which they most certainly will do since most of these loan companies are headed & staffed by powerful & influential Democrats.

    Not to mention they aren’t going to let funding get off to universities to see them shuttered or mass layoffs implemented since that for the most part are the grist mills for the corruption of our youth & where the liberal sausage gets made.


  210. Speranza
    210 | November 27, 2012 6:02 pm

    MacDuff wrote:

    Speranza wrote:
    They should insist on either Bret Baier, Brit Hume or Chris Wallace.

    In all honesty, those three are very impressive journalists and they get little respect because they work for Fox.

    They are the three best journalists on Fox and one of the few reasons I still watch it (I cannot stand Rove, Morris, and Alan Colmes).


  211. Speranza
    211 | November 27, 2012 6:02 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    You don’t get the full effect until you’ve experienced it in a Muslim country.

    I’ll take your word on it.


  212. 212 | November 27, 2012 6:02 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Never happened. Because even in San Francisco, we straights were not all about “don’t interfere with my freedom”, we were all about “please Lord, let me keep myself safe.”

    By the way, before anyone thinks I am a heartless bitch, I lost a great many friends, that contracted this disease before anyone knew what was happening. But let me explain, once we knew, my friends did everything they could to prevent the spread of the disease and I for one became annoyed and angry at people who would treat AIDS victims like they had leprosy. It’s those that came later, those that knew what they needed to do to help eradicate this disease and did nothing to prevent it’s spread because it wasn’t convenient for them that I have no patience with.

    And there is no reason AIDS funding should go to the front of the line, and I’m tired of the special snowflake status they bestow upon themselves.


  213. lobo91
    213 | November 27, 2012 6:03 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Your co-worker probably doesn’t even blow anything up, or kill any animals in his driveway or anything.


  214. 214 | November 27, 2012 6:04 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Oh, yes, I forgot. I’m all inclusive. I say “Screw you, you goat-fucking 7th-century throwback.”


  215. huckfunn
    215 | November 27, 2012 6:04 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    Not unless he plans to write a check to cover them, he can’t.

    Most student loans are issued by banks and guaranteed by the government, much like VA mortgages.

    Forgiving them means the government has to pay them off.

    That’s the assumption based upon law, etc… How many GM bond holders got paid for their bonds when Obama grabbed GM? I’m not much of a finance/banking/econ guy but I know that this is a lawless regime and they are truly out to overturn the apple cart in every way possible. Everything we have accepted all of our lives as inviolable law is being swept away on a daily basis.


  216. 216 | November 27, 2012 6:06 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    Karl Rove needs to be driven out. He is the face for defeat.

    Not to mention a bastard! Not a magnificent bastard mind you…just a bastard!


  217. 217 | November 27, 2012 6:06 pm

    yenta-fada wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:

    The ‘specialness’ of AIDS research dovetails with Buzz’s theory of pushing the gay agenda aka human rights in order to replace actual civil rights.

    Indeed. “Freedom from AIDS” is similar to “freedom from pregnancy” as human rights in that they both completely ignore any manner of personal responsibility. It’s like saying that the “freedom to drink Drano” should be free of the obvious consequences.


  218. Speranza
    218 | November 27, 2012 6:06 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Your co-worker probably doesn’t even blow anything up, or kill any animals in his driveway or anything.

    Funny thing is he is secular, eats pork, drinks alcohol but observes Ramadan.


  219. lobo91
    219 | November 27, 2012 6:06 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    That’s the assumption based upon law, etc… How many GM bond holders got paid for their bonds when Obama grabbed GM?

    Since those loans are held by the same banks that paid for Obama’s re-election, I’m pretty sure they’ll get paid.

    And we’re talking about a trillion dollars here, not $40-50 billion.


  220. Speranza
    220 | November 27, 2012 6:07 pm

    MacDuff wrote:

    Indeed. “Freedom from AIDS” is similar to “freedom from pregnancy” as human rights in that they both completely ignore any manner of personal responsibility. It’s like saying that the “freedom to drink Drano” should be free of the obvious consequences.

    Or a War on Poverty -- a meaningless term.


  221. lobo91
    221 | November 27, 2012 6:08 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Funny thing is he is secular, eats pork, drinks alcohol but observes Ramadan.

    So he only eats pork and drinks alcohol after sundown?


  222. lobo91
    222 | November 27, 2012 6:08 pm

    @ Speranza:

    I want a war on stupidity.

    With real bullets.


  223. Speranza
    223 | November 27, 2012 6:10 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Never happened. Because even in San Francisco, we straights were not all about “don’t interfere with my freedom”, we were all about “please Lord, let me keep myself safe.”
    By the way, before anyone thinks I am a heartless bitch, I lost a great many friends, that contracted this disease before anyone knew what was happening. But let me explain, once we knew, my friends did everything they could to prevent the spread of the disease and I for one became annoyed and angry at people who would treat AIDS victims like they had leprosy. It’s those that came later, those that knew what they needed to do to help eradicate this disease and did nothing to prevent it’s spread because it wasn’t convenient for them that I have no patience with.
    And there is no reason AIDS funding should go to the front of the line, and I’m tired of the special snowflake status they bestow upon themselves.

    AIDS was the first “politically correct” disease that the MSM deliberately spread a ton of misinformation about as to who was in danger. In all the AIDS movies I saw, the victim was usually a straight middle class suburban white guy who got it from sleeping with a hooker or a casual bar pick up.


  224. Speranza
    224 | November 27, 2012 6:11 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    I want a war on stupidity.

    With real bullets.

    Then there is going then to be a lot of bloodshed in faculty lounges.


  225. Speranza
    225 | November 27, 2012 6:12 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Funny thing is he is secular, eats pork, drinks alcohol but observes Ramadan.

    So he only eats pork and drinks alcohol after sundown?

    Only when he hangs out with me.


  226. 226 | November 27, 2012 6:16 pm

    John Difool wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ Iron Fist:
    I’d bet the second term for Obama will be an utter disaster.
    I have no doubt it will be. But if if the GOP runs Jeb Bush, Chris Christie, Rick Santorum or Mike Huckabee we are screwed. I will NOT vote for any of those four.

    Stop donating to the establishment RNC & anyone who thinks this shit is a good idea. I’m convinced more and more these have now become false-flag organizations leftists are pumping money into to get our losing candidates picked for us.

    Yup.

    Speranza wrote:

    Iron Fist wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    She was the best candidate that ran on any ticket in 2008. Period.

    True but that is setting the bar very low.

    Yup.

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    And that is part of the problem. Anyone that offers a serious solution to our most serious problem will, perforce, be wonkish. And so be boring to people who’d rather be entertained than employed.

    Yup.

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Every vote counts.

    Not when elections are being stolen on this scale.

    heysoos wrote:

    Carolina Girl wrote:
    @ heysoos:
    Fine. Explain why she’s a dunce.

    you know I can’t…I’m not hip enough to all the details…from what I saw during interviews she seemed about as informed as any soccer mom with about the same intellect….hardly a deep thinker and certainly not fit for VP…I have a real problem with people assuming they are fit for office by their narrow standard

    I had the same impression.


  227. 227 | November 27, 2012 6:17 pm

    I’ve done 7 Ramadhans in 3 different Islamic countries. Not exactly a big thrill…


  228. huckfunn
    228 | November 27, 2012 6:18 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ huckfunn:

    That’s the assumption based upon law, etc… How many GM bond holders got paid for their bonds when Obama grabbed GM?

    Since those loans are held by the same banks that paid for Obama’s re-election, I’m pretty sure they’ll get paid.

    And we’re talking about a trillion dollars here, not $40-50 billion.

    You undoubtedly understand the banking thing more than I do. However, I think he’s going to do whatever he wants to do; and who’s to stop him? As to those people or institutions who financed and/or voted for him, many of them will find their hopes for payback were based upon false promises. I just don’t know and I have no confidence that there is any recourse against Obama for anything he does.


  229. lobo91
    229 | November 27, 2012 6:23 pm

    Mike C. wrote:

    I’ve done 7 Ramadhans in 3 different Islamic countries. Not exactly a big thrill…

    3 was enough for me.


  230. 230 | November 27, 2012 6:24 pm

    The latest from our little-dicked asshole friend Mike Malloy

    Mike Malloy 26 Nov 2012: …these Tea Bag bastards who by the way, I just wish they would all just go away – or, like in Passover, I just wish there was an angel of the Lord that would pass over – instead of killing the first born in all the households of Egypt just wipe out all the Tea Baggers. Just, you know, the terrible swift sword, just [Mike makes exaggerated "swishing" sounds] – lob their heads off!

    His midnight audience of insomniac meth-heads must have loved this.


  231. Speranza
    231 | November 27, 2012 6:25 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    The latest from our little-dicked asshole friend Mike Malloy

    Mike Malloy 26 Nov 2012: …these Tea Bag bastards who by the way, I just wish they would all just go away – or, like in Passover, I just wish there was an angel of the Lord that would pass over – instead of killing the first born in all the households of Egypt just wipe out all the Tea Baggers. Just, you know, the terrible swift sword, just [Mike makes exaggerated "swishing" sounds] – lob their heads off!

    His midnight audience of insomniac meth-heads must have loved this.

    “Tea bagging” is something he is familiar with -- intimately.


  232. buzzsawmonkey
    232 | November 27, 2012 6:30 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    And sorry, but I remember the gays in S.F. not wanting to close the bathhouses when Don Francis recommended it, saying that to do so infringed on their “freedom.”

    They stopped closure of bathhouses and backroom sex bars in NYC too; the idea was that if people went there they could be “educated about safe sex” and have easy access to condoms which, as we know, are a difficult-to-find controlled item which are only available otherwise by prescription.

    There had been talk, early in the days of the epidemic, of quarantining people diagnosed with AIDS. Quarantine was practiced 100 years ago with people suffering from TB, then called “the white plague”; it is, perhaps, comparable because TB was quite widespread at that time (interestingly, that is why there used to be signs against spitting in the subway; the spittle was feared as a spreader of TB).

    It is, however, unlikely that quarantine would have worked against AIDS, because with the incubation time of at least 6 months before it was detectable with the then-available technology (and there are things like sarcoidosis which give false positives on AIDS tests), it would not only have required a very widespread quarantine, but the long lead in detectability would have ensured that the disease continued to spread.

    In any event, the possibility of quarantine never had a chance; people started screaming about concentration camps and “gay genocide” if anyone had the temerity to mention it.


  233. 233 | November 27, 2012 6:37 pm

    Pat Toomey is saying he will stand by his pledge to his voters not to raise taxes.

    Oh look. A spine! Someone take a photo and show it to Boehner. Make a copy for Eric Cantor.


  234. lobo91
    234 | November 27, 2012 6:37 pm

    @ buzzsawmonkey:

    The thing that irritates me the most about the whole AIDS issue is the amount of vitriol that’s heaped on Reagan over it, as if he somehow had something to do with its spread.


  235. 235 | November 27, 2012 6:44 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    Cancer should be a priority.


  236. 236 | November 27, 2012 6:45 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    The thing that irritates me the most about the whole AIDS issue is the amount of vitriol that’s heaped on Reagan over it, as if he somehow had something to do with its spread.

    Meanwhile one of Reagan’s closet friends Rock Hudson died of it. I never understood the whole hating reagan over aids crap.


  237. Bumr50
    237 | November 27, 2012 6:45 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    Thanks!

    Finally something I can feel good about as a Pennsylvanian since election day. (Other than beating Mark Critz)

    I live in the little blue county in the sea of red in the SW corner.


  238. 238 | November 27, 2012 6:46 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    lobo91 wrote:
    @ buzzsawmonkey:
    The thing that irritates me the most about the whole AIDS issue is the amount of vitriol that’s heaped on Reagan over it, as if he somehow had something to do with its spread.

    Rodan wrote:
    Meanwhile one of Reagan’s closest friends Rock Hudson died of it. I never understood the whole hating reagan over aids crap.


  239. buzzsawmonkey
    239 | November 27, 2012 6:49 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    The thing that irritates me the most about the whole AIDS issue is the amount of vitriol that’s heaped on Reagan over it, as if he somehow had something to do with its spread.

    It actually had nothing to do with Reagan; it was a lefty ploy to personalize and polarize the “gay community” along Alinsky lines. There was nothing that could have been done that was not done for AIDS victims at the time ACT UP started; its purpose was to get a new, non-Sixties, generation used to demonstrating and behaving badly in public, and focused on the idea that Republicans Are The Enemy.

    That was all it was for, and it succeeded admirably. Plenty of people with otherwise good sense got themselves good and brainwashed, and well-meaning heterosexuals got used to viewing gays as Victims Of The Evil Conservatives. The “great heterosexual breakout of AIDS” actually happened, but it was not of the disease; it was of AIDS being used to get the gay movement to breakout into the larger society. All those well-meaning non-gay types who started wearing red ribbons made “AIDS research”, i.e., Save the Gays, cool; and it is because of ACT UP making gays “cool” that we now have widespread acceptance of the “marriage equality” campaign.


  240. Speranza
    240 | November 27, 2012 6:51 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    Meanwhile one of Reagan’s closest friends Rock Hudson died of it. I never understood the whole hating reagan over aids crap.

    Yeah that whole “It’s Reagan’s fault that people are dying of AIDS” was rather perverse. Even Randy Shilts who blamed the gay bathhouse culture with its anonymous sex with scores of “partners”, also blamed Reagan.


  241. 241 | November 27, 2012 6:53 pm

    @ lobo91:

    They said that Reagan didn’t care about AIDS and refused to acknowledge it until his friend Rock Hudson was diagnosed.

    Wrong. Reagan was unwilling to write a blank check for research and benefits. He did not veto any spending bills by the Democrats, led by Philip Burton, for this, even though as a percentage of the population affected overall, it was small.

    Commenting on a national epidemic is not Reagan’s job. I believe that’s what we have a Surgeon General for. Also a CDC. And local Departments of Health. All of whom the Gay community turned a deaf ear to. I doubt that they gave a crap what Reagan thought -- he was just someone they could vent their rage on.


  242. Speranza
    242 | November 27, 2012 6:54 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Pat Toomey is saying he will stand by his pledge to his voters not to raise taxes.
    Oh look. A spine! Someone take a photo and show it to Boehner. Make a copy for Eric Cantor.

    I don’t care about raising taxes on the rich, most of whom voted for Obama. They cannot have it both ways -- vote for Obama but count on Republicans to protect them from high taxes (see the Upper East Side of Manhattan).


  243. 243 | November 27, 2012 6:55 pm

    @ Speranza:

    I remember getting into a heated argument with Randy at the Elephant Walk on Castro Street. I said “you must tell me what you think the President could have done, Randy, that Don Francis couldn’t.”


  244. Speranza
    244 | November 27, 2012 6:58 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Commenting on a national epidemic is not Reagan’s job. I believe that’s what we have a Surgeon General for

    Surgeon General C. Everett Koop (another Reagan mistake alongside GHW Bush and Sandra Day O’Connor) bought into the whole heterosexual AIDS myth. Probably because he was an ultra social conservative and was against pre-marital sex.


  245. Speranza
    245 | November 27, 2012 7:01 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    I remember getting into a heated argument with Randy at the Elephant Walk on Castro Street. I said “you must tell me what you think the President could have done, Randy, that Don Francis couldn’t.”

    Ideology trumps all -- and Randy was probably the most honest of the “gay” writers on what caused AIDS (he denounced the whole notion that straights were just as much at risk for AIDS as were gays), yet politics intrudes upon everything. Most people affected by HIV contracted it during the Carter years and Dimmy Jimmy was not to blame and neither was Reagan.


  246. buzzsawmonkey
    246 | November 27, 2012 7:03 pm

    The modern, Maoist-and-New-Left-led gay-rights movement came along at the tail end of the Vietnam War protests. It would have remained a marginal freak show were it not for two things: The Rocky Horror Picture Show and disco music. Rocky Horror was a runaway hit that brought “gay consciousness” to an entire generation of youngsters, and made transvestism and bisexuality, if not “cool,” less uncool and fear-inspiring than they had been. Disco was the breakout of the gay male bar-queen lifestyle, with its drugs and promiscuity, into the society at large.

    When the eruption of AIDS put an end to the nonstop fuck party of disco, the fact that many straights had been living a “disco lifestyle” made the nagging fear that AIDS would break out into the population at large a credible thing. So the society was disposed to tolerate the antics of ACT UP, which—more than the actual Stonewall Riot—was the gay movement’s “Civil Rights Movement,” the Heavy Petting Bridge, if you will, rather than the Edmund Pettus Bridge, for indeed the ACT UP demos were what made “gay rights” mainstream.

    In this context, the gay movement’s fight to keep the bathhouses open—a decision which probably cost tens of thousands of lives—was perfectly logical. It guaranteed an ongoing stream of infection, illness and death—an ongoing stream of victims around which to agitate.


  247. Bumr50
    247 | November 27, 2012 7:04 pm

    Stephen Crowder decides that “drugs are bad” (mmmkay)and goes on the street to ridicule folks who favor legalization.

    I guess there’s nothing more pressing to focus his time and energy on currently.

    I don’t favor legalization, but only because the government can’t wait to get it’s mitts on a new “thing” to tax and regulate.

    Anyhow, what good does this do? It seems to me that this is the kind of thing that kills us on election day.


  248. 248 | November 27, 2012 7:04 pm

    Oh hell, everybody remember when Joe the Morning Schmoe at MSLSD told us the reason we didn’t win was because Hunstman wasn’t the nominee? Well, check this out — and we all KNEW he was a lib in rhino clothing anyway (H/T Zip)

    Former Republican presidential candidate Jon Huntsman on Monday urged lawmakers, including those in his own party, to temper their criticism of the administration’s handling of the attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya.

    Huntsman, who served as U.S. ambassador to China under President Barack Obama, said that it would have been nearly impossible for authorities to instantly obtain accurate intelligence about who was responsible for the September attack, which resulted in the death of four officials. Because of that, he said, recent criticism of U.N. Ambassador Susan Rice for not immediately declaring the attack an act of terror was either politically motivated or misplaced.

    “The issue of Benghazi, I think you can attribute to the fog of war, more than anything else,” Huntsman said in an interview with The Huffington Post. “When you’re in a wartime setting and you have an attack like that — let’s face it. No one is prepared for an attack like that. There is, as Robert McNamara used to say, there is a fog of war. And it takes awhile to sort through the details. And it doesn’t do a whole lot of good for the political class to point fingers before you even know what was behind it. And you’re not going to know that [immediately].”


  249. 249 | November 27, 2012 7:07 pm

    @ Speranza:

    Yup. Randy once told me that “if we’re not careful, we’ll all be marching to our own doom.

    I have an autographed copy of “And the Band Played On.” San Francisco is an interesting small town atmosphere. Especially in the Castro. I knew Harvey Milk, Clive Jones, Randy Shilts and even met Don Francis when he came to town.


  250. lobo91
    250 | November 27, 2012 7:09 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    Huntsman, who served as U.S. ambassador to China under President Barack Obama, said that it would have been nearly impossible for authorities to instantly obtain accurate intelligence about who was responsible for the September attack, which resulted in the death of four officials.

    Unfortunately for him, nobody expected any such “instant” intelligence.

    They knew who was responsible within 24 hours, and Susan Rice went on TV 5 days later and put out bad information.

    It’s not a complicated issue.


  251. Speranza
    251 | November 27, 2012 7:10 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Oh hell, everybody remember when Joe the Morning Schmoe at MSLSD told us the reason we didn’t win was because Hunstman wasn’t the nominee? Well, check this out — and we all KNEW he was a lib in rhino clothing anyway (H/T Zip)

    I used to like him but now I know he is a lightweight.


  252. lobo91
    252 | November 27, 2012 7:10 pm

    @ Carolina Girl:

    Sounds like Huntsman’s looking for a new job. I know where there’s an opening for an ambassador…


  253. Speranza
    253 | November 27, 2012 7:11 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Yup. Randy once told me that “if we’re not careful, we’ll all be marching to our own doom.
    I have an autographed copy of “And the Band Played On.” San Francisco is an interesting small town atmosphere. Especially in the Castro. I knew Harvey Milk, Clive Jones, Randy Shilts and even met Don Francis when he came to town.

    I read that book.


  254. buzzsawmonkey
    254 | November 27, 2012 7:15 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    “The issue of Benghazi, I think you can attribute to the fog of war, more than anything else,” Huntsman said in an interview with The Huffington Post

    No, Mr. Huntsman, it was not “the fog of war”; it was the fog machine of war upon the American people.


  255. huckfunn
    255 | November 27, 2012 7:20 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    “The issue of Benghazi, I think you can attribute to the fog of war, more than anything else,” Huntsman said in an interview with The Huffington Post. “When you’re in a wartime setting and you have an attack like that — let’s face it. No one is prepared for an attack like that”.

    The fog is mostly between Huntsman’s ears. It was 9/11, for Pete’s sake! They damn well should have been at Defcon 1.


  256. Bumr50
    256 | November 27, 2012 7:21 pm

    @ lobo91:

    Maybe if we sent Ron Paul, he’d come back and make sense.


  257. 257 | November 27, 2012 7:32 pm

    lobo91 wrote:

    @ Carolina Girl:
    Sounds like Huntsman’s looking for a new job. I know where there’s an opening for an ambassador…

    Libya!


  258. 258 | November 27, 2012 7:33 pm

    New Thread.


  259. 259 | November 27, 2012 7:39 pm

    @ huckfunn:

    Indeed -- “Fog of War?” This was LIBYA, not Afghanistan.
    Please don’t tell me Huntsman’s another one already trying to get themselves on the national stage in an attempt to keep their name recognition alive for 2016.


  260. 260 | November 27, 2012 7:42 pm

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ huckfunn:
    Indeed — “Fog of War?” This was LIBYA, not Afghanistan.
    Please don’t tell me Huntsman’s another one already trying to get themselves on the national stage in an attempt to keep their name recognition alive for 2016.

    He’s probably getting ready for 2016 as well.


  261. Da_Beerfreak
    261 | November 27, 2012 7:55 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ huckfunn:
    Indeed — “Fog of War?” This was LIBYA, not Afghanistan.
    Please don’t tell me Huntsman’s another one already trying to get themselves on the national stage in an attempt to keep their name recognition alive for 2016.

    He’s probably getting ready for 2016 as well.

    Everybody should know by now that the Presidential campagne for 2016 started on November 7, 2012. :twisted:
    The next four years are going to seem like an eternity… :evil:


  262. Lily
    262 | November 27, 2012 7:57 pm

    Speranza wrote:

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Speranza:
    Every vote counts.

    Exactly and that includes strippers, rappers, porn stars, etc. We should not turn down any vote.

    So become just like the democrat party so you can win! Right???? Yeah I don’t see this working at all. But hey go ahead with the big tent and become just like Republicans. You don’t defeat evil by becoming evil.


  263. Lily
    263 | November 27, 2012 7:59 pm

    @ Lily:

    Become just like democrats… PIMF


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