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Obamacare not the Only Obama Mandate Crashing and Burning

by Mars ( 176 Comments › )
Filed under Academia, Barack Obama, Cult of Obama, Democratic Party, Education, Fight Thread, Free Speech, Multiculturalism, Political Correctness, Politics, Progressives, Regulation at January 2nd, 2014 - 7:00 am

Here’s an article from National Review on Common Core. The central tenet of the article is that we can’t have a debate on Common Core because even it’ advocates aren’t being honest about who they are and what they want. Well, inside the article there is something more interesting. It seems Common Core is collapsing without any outside interference. Like everything else the liberals do, it is unorganized and chaotic. Conflicting standards, overly bloated textbook selections, unclear goals, and no sense of authority whatsoever.

As Chester E. Finn Jr., president of the Thomas Fordham Institute and a longtime champion of national standards, observed in 2010, “For these standards to get traction . . . a whole bunch of other things need to happen. Curriculum needs to happen, textbooks need to be aligned with the curriculum, teacher preparation and professional development need to be aligned, tests need to be aligned, [and] the accountability system that is built on those tests needs to make sense.”

There’s little evidence that Common Core boosters really believe that states, school districts, and commercial providers will make this work on their own. For instance, a quick search of Amazon for “Common Core” shows more than 30,000 books — and superintendents and teachers are quick to acknowledge that no one knows how to tell the good from the bad. Finn’s Fordham Foundation just released a report noting that most English teachers are not assigning the kinds of reading envisioned by the Common Core. The National Council on Teacher Quality recently reported that the vast majority of education schools are not preparing new teachers to teach the Common Core. Right now, school districts, states, and Common Core advocates don’t have an answer for any of this.

In each case, plenty of Washington-based Common Core enthusiasts think the feds need to help get this stuff right. In 2011, the American Federation of Teachers endorsed the creation of a national curriculum to support the Common Core. The National Governors Association has previously called on Uncle Sam to help fund and encourage Common Core implementation. The Obama Department of Education has embraced a much more prescriptive role in telling states how to measure teacher effectiveness and where teachers should teach.

States including Oklahoma, Georgia, and Florida have announced that they’re abandoning the federally recognized Common Core tests, and other states are weighing similar moves. These states have promised to develop their own tests. But someone will still feel obliged to determine whether those new tests meet promises states have made to Washington in order to secure federal education funds. This opens the door to federal officials’ micromanaging test design and even test scoring.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/367085/common-core-slippery-slope-frederick-m-hess-michael-q-mcshane

As most here now, I loathe the Politico, I think they are a bunch of leftist radicals masquerading as middle of the road. But, here is something interesting from them.

Common Core testing problems seem inevitable

By CAITLIN EMMA | 12/27/13 11:46 AM EST

The education world is scrambling to avoid its own version of a full-scale HealthCare.gov meltdown when millions of students pilot new digital Common Core tests this spring.

Technological hiccups, much less large-scale meltdowns, won’t do: The results of the Common Core tests will influence teachers’ and principals’ evaluations and other decisions about their jobs. Schools will be rated on the results. Students’ promotion to the next grade or graduation from high school may hinge on their scores. And the already-controversial Common Core standards, designed to be tested using a new generation of sophisticated exams that go beyond multiple-choice testing, may be further dragged through the mud if there are crises.

States and the test developers have thought through some of the possible pitfalls. For example, some schools are stocking up on technology, and the tests have been designed to go easy on schools’ Internet infrastructure.

But problems with the exams seem imminent if issues during other large-scale online assessments are any indication: Schools’ bandwidth could collapse under the stress of too many students testing at the same time. Computers could hang up or crash. And schools in some places will have to come up with creative schedules to test all of their students, who may far outnumber available computers. Some schools are already planning to take paper exams until their districts can get up to technological speed — even though those tests will cost more per student than online counterparts and might throw off comparisons with computer-based tests.

“There will be bumps in the first couple years,” said Jeff Livingston, senior vice president of education policy and strategic alliances at McGraw-Hill. “There’s no question in my mind about that … It’s an engineering problem and a policy problem.”

The tests will be given on a massive scale: Roughly 4.2 million third through eighth graders will test the exams in math and English this spring, and 29 million students nationwide will use them starting next school year.

Last spring, Kentucky students taking digital end-of-course assessments designed by ACT had to switch to paper and pencil after slow and dropped connections complicated the testing. Alabama and Ohio students also had problems.

The Kentucky Department of Education wanted ACT to conduct a “stress test” in mid-November to see if the server could handle 20,000 students at one time. ACT was supposed to make software corrections and hardware fixes to improve the online system, but the testing company told the state those fixes wouldn’t be ready for the stress tests or next round of end-of-course exams. The stress test was ultimately canceled.

In addition, CTB/McGraw-Hill apologized last spring for interruptions after its digital testing service disrupted exams in Indiana and Oklahoma. About 3,000 students in Oklahoma lost their connections to the testing provider’s servers. And nearly 80,000 out of a half million Indiana students who took the company’s tests in the spring had their testing postponed and about 30,000 were kicked off of the testing platform on a single day of testing. One Indiana charter school has said the errors are to blame for its F grade from the state.

The company said the Indiana outage occurred because “our simulations did not fully anticipate the patterns of live student testing.” Members of the Indiana Board of Education called the situation “disastrous.”

Oklahoma dropped out of one of the groups developing Common Core tests in early July, citing technology challenges as one of its leading reasons.

Wyoming ditched its online testing system a few years ago, after network infrastructure buckled when 80,000 students tried to take state exams. The debacle cost the state superintendent his job.

Those problems and others have the potential to play out on a much larger, more public stage in the coming years.

“There’s a lot of anxiety in the field, and I think it’s rational,” said Brian Lewis, CEO of the International Society for Technology in Education.

At least four states have officially withdrawn from the testing consortia. Other states are teetering on the edge of their relationships with the federally funded groups devising the tests, decrying cost, federal overreach and the potential tech troubles. A shaky roll out could burn more bridges with those organizations and drive up the cost of testing for remaining states.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/12/common-core-testing-problems-seem-inevitable-101568.html#ixzz2okBO24oP

Of course there are many out there that think these problems were planned in order to pave the way for even more government interference. I see this as possible, however, this administration has shown itself over and over as incapable of even getting their own nefarious schemes done right.

So, time will tell. Is this a monumental disaster and screwup? Or is this another plan for a huge federal power grab? Feel free to fight it out in the comment section.

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176 Responses to “Obamacare not the Only Obama Mandate Crashing and Burning”
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  1. coldwarrior
    1 | January 2, 2014 7:20 am

    goldwater warned us about this…dc takes your money, launders it, gives is back with strings attached.

    this common core testing is no more than the english system of ‘leaving exams’. screw them up and no college for you! which might be a good thing.

    we have 50 state with 50 education bureaucracies, let them run the schools.


  2. coldwarrior
    2 | January 2, 2014 7:21 am

    the other problem with this is that it is centrally controlled and will be manipulated politically.


  3. 3 | January 2, 2014 7:51 am

    @ coldwarrior:

    Obama has shown us that everything the Federal Government touches will be politicized. Of course these kind of tests will be subject to political manipulation. That is probably the whole point of them. I have become convinced that the main thing college does for most people is saddle them with a burden of debt that will take them half their lives to pay off. It didn’t do that to me, but I had scholarships. Too, when I went for my second degree, I had the sense to go to a community college that I could pay cash for, even on my rather meager salary. Community college or trade school is where the bulk of the people need to be. That isn’t to say I didn’t learn things in my four-year degree. I did, and most importantly, I learned better how to learn. The difference in my GPA (3.06 for my Poly Sci degree vs. a 4.0 for my Computer Science) serves as proof of that, and that is, indeed, one of the most valuable skills you can learn. But it wouldn’t have been worth it if I’d had to pay full freight for it. Coming out of school with a mortgage’s worth of student debt is not a formula for success.


  4. 4 | January 2, 2014 7:56 am

    @ coldwarrior:
    @ Iron Fist:

    They are pushing an American version of Juche that centers around Obama being some divine being.


  5. 5 | January 2, 2014 7:57 am

    One thing of interest from my high school education. When I was in tenth grade, my history teacher won national teacher of the year that year (1985, IIRC). She was very, very good. She really did challenge me intellectually. One of our required readings that year was Machiavelli’s The Prince and another was George Orwell’s Animal Farm. While she had her leftist bent on things (I think), no hard-core Leftist is going to assign Animal Farm to her students. She did not consider it her mission to indoctrinate her students. While it was my ninth grade homeroom teacher who got me interested in going to the Military Academy, it was my tenth grade history teacher that got me interested in politics.


  6. 6 | January 2, 2014 8:02 am

    @ Rodan:

    I don’t know that they are exactly doing that. Yeah, we had the example of the elementary school teacher who had her kids singing hymns to Obama, but I tend o think that kind of thing is rare. What they are teaching, without a doubt, is a Leftist world view, and the semi-divine right of the State to direct and control their lives. Obama himself will be off the stage in three years. He isn’t (likely) to be able to continue to be a focal point after that. His best two years fro passing n agenda are long gone. Unless the Left wins the House back in the fall, he will get no further legislation passed. I know there is the rumor that Boehner is going to sell us out on immigration. I don’t think it is likely that he’ll be able to bring the House along for that ride, even with Paul Ryan’s disappointing defection. ObamaCare will continue to get worse, eroding any chance Obama has for passing any further legislation. I don’t know what he may do by Executive Order, though.


  7. 7 | January 2, 2014 8:06 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    The Prince should be required reading for anyone wanting to understand politics, especially the clown show called the GOP. You best bet the Democrats have read that book in and out.


  8. 8 | January 2, 2014 8:11 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    They are pushing Obama as some spiritual being.


    3rd grade lesson plan presents messianic view of Obama – literally

    This is pure Juche.


  9. 9 | January 2, 2014 8:13 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    I know there is the rumor that Boehner is going to sell us out on immigration.

    They probably will come up with a Republican version of it to say they have a plan. It’s just to inoculate themselves from Democrat rhetoric.

    My big question though is why the Right never bitches about Islamic Immigration?


  10. 10 | January 2, 2014 8:14 am

    @ Rodan:

    Yeah, I’ve read it two or three time. You are right. It is essential reading if you want to understand politics. While some of the examples are dated, the same principles apply today. It is kind of like the Art of War in that. What is funny about the Prince is that Machiavelli starts it off with an intro about how great painters give gifts of murals and sculpture to the ruler, always their finest works, and in that manner he is giving Lorenzo di Medici his finest gift: the gift of his political genius. There is no indication that di Medici ever took it to heart or, for that matter, even read it. Nowadays nobody recognizes the name of Lorenzo, but everybody knows Machiavelli. He wasn’t really exaggerating the genius of his work, even though the intro is very self-serving and seemingly overblown.


  11. 11 | January 2, 2014 8:15 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    I don’t know what he may do by Executive Order, though.

    He’s going to pull a Caligula and declare himself a god.


  12. eaglesoars
    12 | January 2, 2014 8:17 am

    I blame W.

    I’m serious. That No Child Left Behind crap did a lot to nationalize what should have been left to the individual school districts. Of course, if I had my druthers, I’d nuke the Dept of Education but…..

    Look, Common Core is Common Crap. Anytime you start with the metrics to measure performance at a macro level, people start lying thru their teeth. It’s a one-size-fits-all prescription for disaster. Also, it’s a handy-dandy back door for the state to grab the kids via the teachers union.

    Here, in D.C., where Michelle Rhee, tried to implement a common sense student/teacher evaluation system, she was run out of town. And that is just one city.


  13. 13 | January 2, 2014 8:20 am

    Rodan wrote:

    My big question though is why the Right never bitches about Islamic Immigration?

    Some people do, but not our so-called “leaders”. As you well know, I want to see Islamic Immigration ended. Interestingly enough, Bob Beckel (a man I despise) is on our side about Muslim immigration. He is solidly a man of the Left, but he does have the intestinal fortitude to recognize our enemy for who they really are. Ending Islamic immigration is a no-brainer. I don’t see how anybody can view importing them as a good thing. But the Chamber of Commerce s for anything that brings in cheap labor, and most of the Republican leadership pays attention very carefully to what the Chamber wants.


  14. 14 | January 2, 2014 8:20 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:

    I don’t know what he may do by Executive Order, though.

    He’s going to pull a Caligula and declare himself a god.

    Michelle’s going to be a Senator?


  15. eaglesoars
    15 | January 2, 2014 8:21 am

    MacDuff wrote:

    Michelle’s going to be a Senator?

    she’s going to be the horse


  16. 16 | January 2, 2014 8:22 am

    Rodan wrote:

    He’s going to pull a Caligula and declare himself a god.

    It’ll be interesting to see if he does exactly that. That would be the ultimate act of narcissism, and he’d got narcissism bad. It isn’t good when the President of the United States has a mental illness that is so easily identified.


  17. 17 | January 2, 2014 8:22 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    The Art of War should be required reading as well.


  18. 18 | January 2, 2014 8:24 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    MacDuff wrote:

    Michelle’s going to be a Senator?

    she’s going to be the horse

    Yeah, Caligula made his horse a Senator…..


  19. 19 | January 2, 2014 8:24 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    Here, in D.C., where Michelle Rhee, tried to implement a common sense student/teacher evaluation system, she was run out of town. And that is just one city.

    Yeah, I remember hearing about that. DC schools are shit, and this woman knew how to change that. The Parents didn’t want their little darlings to face tough work at school. In the end, the parents don’t seem particularly concerned that their children aren’t learning in school. I guess they figure you don’t have to be able to read to get EBT.


  20. 20 | January 2, 2014 8:24 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    It is not the Chamber of Commerce that wants Muslims here. That’s conflating 2 separate issues. My bigger point is where are these big mouth Republicans that always bitch about Mexicans and Central Americans, when it comes to Islam? They are very silent and I know why.


  21. 21 | January 2, 2014 8:25 am

    @ MacDuff:

    I have no doubt she will run for office and a get a Senatorship.


  22. 22 | January 2, 2014 8:25 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:

    The Art of War should be required reading as well.

    That just wouldn’t be appropriate in our emasculated culture, dontcha know.


  23. 23 | January 2, 2014 8:26 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    You nailed it.


  24. RIX
    24 | January 2, 2014 8:26 am

    Good morning. FNC is reporting at the NYT is saying that their “reporter on the ground” in Benghazi is a Libyan..
    I wonder if he carried ammo for the attackers.


  25. eaglesoars
    25 | January 2, 2014 8:27 am

    Rodan wrote:

    He’s going to pull a Caligula and declare himself a god.

    well, not exactly. It worked in Rome because there gods and ceasars were conflated. But it wouldn’t surprise me if he -- via executive order -- suspended whichever consitutional clause provides for presidential term limits under some pretense.


  26. 26 | January 2, 2014 8:30 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ MacDuff:

    I have no doubt she will run for office and a get a Senatorship.

    Eh, I kinda think we’ve reached “peak Obama”.


  27. 27 | January 2, 2014 8:30 am

    @ Rodan:

    It should be. I read it on my own when I was a freshman in college, simply because I believe it is one of those books you should read. Did I tell you what my mother got me for Christmas? Gibbon’s Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, all eight volumes. I was very surprised by that. I don’t think that my mom even knows who Gibbon is. I don’t know when I am going to have the time to read it, but it is another of those books that you simply should read to have a broader understanding of the world.


  28. 28 | January 2, 2014 8:31 am

    @ MacDuff:

    Have you seen Camile Paglia emphasizing the de-masculization of our culture? What has gotten into her. She was a Lefty and is now calling out the Left’s Metrosexual-Hipster agenda.


  29. 29 | January 2, 2014 8:34 am

    Rodan wrote:

    It is not the Chamber of Commerce that wants Muslims here.

    It is in Tennessee. They are bringing in Somalis to work in the chicken industry out near Murfreesboro. There’s a lot of tension in the community as a result of that. The Locals don’t want them importing trouble, no matter what the economic benefits are for the companies involved. They tried (and failed) to get a court injunction against building a mosque there.


  30. 30 | January 2, 2014 8:34 am

    @ MacDuff:
    @ Iron Fist:
    @ eaglesoars:

    De Blasio is off to the races.

    De Blasio Inauguration Starts With ‘Plantation’ Rhetoric

    During the election season, Bill de Blasio was often painted by conservatives as a leftist radical. But at his inauguration today, it was not Mr. de Blasio who dropped the most aggressive lines, but the first two speakers at the event.

    In particular, Rev. Fred Lucas Jr., who was among several chaplains representing the city’s uniformed workers, surprised many observers by comparing the five boroughs to a “plantation.”

    “Let the plantation called New York City be the city of God, a city set upon the hill, a light shining in darkness,” he declared. “Elevate our valleys. Make low our mountains. Make our crooked places straight and our rough places smooth. Oh God, oh God, oh God, break every chain, break every chain, break every chain.”


  31. 31 | January 2, 2014 8:35 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Personally I am convinced the Muslims are manipulating events in this country and are pitting all of against each other so America collapses into ethnic and regional civil wars.


  32. eaglesoars
    32 | January 2, 2014 8:35 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    The Parents didn’t want their little darlings to face tough work at school. In the end, the parents don’t seem particularly concerned that their children aren’t learning in school. I guess they figure you don’t have to be able to read to get EBT.

    If that’s what you read, it was a very distorted telling. The concern was valid -- their children had not been provided the educational background to achieve good results. The D.C. school district then instituted a voucher system -- which a lot of families clamoured for. So, Obama’s education czar, Arne Duncan, came in and killed the voucher system.

    Keep ‘em on the plantation.

    I think in many ways, D.C. gets a bad rap -- the politicians elected to the city council are just the dregs -- and Marion Barry will forever taint the brand -- but there are a lot of solid black families/parents who are simply outnumbered.


  33. 33 | January 2, 2014 8:36 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ MacDuff:

    Have you seen Camile Paglia emphasizing the de-masculization of our culture? What has gotten into her. She was a Lefty and is now calling out the Left’s Metrosexual-Hipster agenda.

    Paglia has had some remarkably reasonable moments for a number of years now. She has no taste for Kool-Aid, regardless of flavor.


  34. RIX
    34 | January 2, 2014 8:38 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    a Community activist in Minneapolis is very upset about the explosion & fire in the apartment building.
    He desribed it as a gathering plae for East Africans, That would translate Somalis.


  35. 35 | January 2, 2014 8:38 am

    @ MacDuff:

    At least 40% of the country loves this family. In Illinois he is still very popular, so I can see her winning a seat there. Heck I can see him wanting his old Senate seat back.


  36. 36 | January 2, 2014 8:38 am

    Rodan wrote:

    Have you seen Camile Paglia emphasizing the de-masculization of our culture? What has gotten into her.

    She is, by all accounts, an intellectually honest person. She is personally gay, but doesn’t think that that condition should be spread to the whole of the human race. The people who are pushing for a de-masculinization of men are not doing so with the good of society in mind. They know that it will lead to a less stable society, but that is what they want.


  37. eaglesoars
    37 | January 2, 2014 8:40 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ MacDuff:
    Have you seen Camile Paglia emphasizing the de-masculization of our culture? What has gotten into her. She was a Lefty and is now calling out the Left’s Metrosexual-Hipster agenda.

    You misunderstand Paglia. She’s been brutal intellectually to EVERYBODY. She’s honest. You may not agree with her, but to call her a ‘lefty’ is to give far too much credit to the left. I don’t follow her a lot because she talks about art, a cultural venue that gives me a headache, but as a cultural observer she’s right up there.


  38. 38 | January 2, 2014 8:44 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    but there are a lot of solid black families/parents who are simply outnumbered.

    Could be. I obviously haven’t seen things from the perspective of someone raised in DC. I know the schools are a failing, bloody mess. I didn’t realize that it was Obama who killed the voucher program, though. Yet blacks still love him. I frankly don’t understand that. Obama has been bad for white people, of course, but he has been every so much worse for blacks.


  39. 39 | January 2, 2014 8:46 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    Rodan wrote:

    @ MacDuff:
    Have you seen Camile Paglia emphasizing the de-masculization of our culture? What has gotten into her. She was a Lefty and is now calling out the Left’s Metrosexual-Hipster agenda.

    You misunderstand Paglia. She’s been brutal intellectually to EVERYBODY. She’s honest. You may not agree with her, but to call her a ‘lefty’ is to give far too much credit to the left. I don’t follow her a lot because she talks about art, a cultural venue that gives me a headache, but as a cultural observer she’s right up there.

    Years ago, Rush told a funny story about him and Paglia being seated next to each other at some function. They apparently had a wonderful time smoking cigars and discussing the issues of the day. Yeah, she’s definitely her own woman.


  40. 40 | January 2, 2014 8:46 am

    @ Rodan:

    It is interesting that he invokes God in his speech. That can’t have set well with his supporters. If he were a Republican and given that speech, they’d be calling him the Christian Taliban, and a wannabe slave-master for the plantation remark. As it is, I am surprised he was that honest. The Democrats do consider the social welfare state as their own personal plantation. They want everybody to be slaves.


  41. eaglesoars
    41 | January 2, 2014 8:47 am

    Oh a story about Paglia that Rush Limbaugh tells. He was invited to some shindig and just for grins the organizers put Limbaugh and Paglia at the same table, expecting fireworks.

    They got along like a house on fire. Much to the instigators’ chagrin.

    It’s called starting out from a position of respect and going from there.


  42. eaglesoars
    42 | January 2, 2014 8:48 am

    @ MacDuff:

    GMTA!


  43. 43 | January 2, 2014 8:48 am

    RIX wrote:

    He desribed it as a gathering plae for East Africans, That would translate Somalis.

    Which makes it more likely that this was a work-accident when they were building bombs. I haven’t heard any official cause for the blast. If it was a bomb, they’ll keep quiet about it.


  44. 44 | January 2, 2014 8:48 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    @ MacDuff:

    GMTA!

    Indeed! :D


  45. eaglesoars
    45 | January 2, 2014 8:49 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    I didn’t realize that it was Obama who killed the voucher program, though.

    have to placate the teachers union


  46. eaglesoars
    46 | January 2, 2014 8:51 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    Which makes it more likely that this was a work-accident when they were building bombs. I haven’t heard any official cause for the blast. If it was a bomb, they’ll keep quiet about it.

    there was something on a thread from last nite. I’ll see if I can find it.


  47. eaglesoars
    47 | January 2, 2014 8:53 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    there was something on a thread from last nite. I’ll see if I can find it.

    no. I was thinking of something else


  48. 48 | January 2, 2014 8:55 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    So she’s just a straight shooter then. I’ve been reading her recent stuff and give her props for speaking the truth.


  49. 49 | January 2, 2014 8:56 am

    @ eaglesoars:
    Yeah, the teacher’s union is one of the worst political groups out there. They are the ones enforcing the indoctrination of students. They also have a predilection to supporting child molesters, something that if they were, say, the Catholic Church, they’d get hell over.


  50. 50 | January 2, 2014 8:57 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    She is personally gay, but doesn’t think that that condition should be spread to the whole of the human race.

    She does not want to push her sexual preference on society.


  51. eaglesoars
    51 | January 2, 2014 8:57 am

    Rodan wrote:

    So she’s just a straight shooter then.

    Absolutely. She also has a good sense of humor. I’d love to meet her and get shit-faced.

    gotta get the girls to daycamp. later


  52. 52 | January 2, 2014 8:58 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Al-Shabaab.


  53. RIX
    53 | January 2, 2014 9:02 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    RIX wrote:

    He desribed it as a gathering plae for East Africans, That would translate Somalis.

    Which makes it more likely that this was a work-accident when they were building bombs. I haven’t heard any official cause for the blast. If it was a bomb, they’ll keep quiet about it.

    I think that bomb building gone bad is ilkely.


  54. Guggi
    54 | January 2, 2014 9:03 am

    “The Prince” is a core element of postmodernists. Nietzsche’s “Übermensch” (superman) was modelled along “The Prince” and postmodernists are elitists.

    To be fair: Cesare Borgia, who was the archetype for “Il Principe” by Machiavelli, was a very intelligent and reasonable person and a good ruler. Of course he was also a “man of his time” the Renaissace. I doubt that any one of us wants to live in that time again.


  55. 55 | January 2, 2014 9:10 am

    Glock is introducing a .380. I, myself, am not sold on the .380 as a defensive round. It just doesn’t have the stopping power that I’d like in a carry gun. If you are going to go with a smaller caliber like that, I’d rather go with a .357 magnum. The .357 packs quite a wallop, and the recoil is very manageable.


  56. 56 | January 2, 2014 9:16 am

    @ Guggi:

    The Prince calls for a ruler who is “Beyond good and evil”, as it were. I can see where the postmodernists would like that. But it is also a very realistic take on power politics. At the end of the day, it is better to be feared than to be loved. Machiavelli himself was a (small “R”) republican at heart, but he saw that a ruthless ruler was what was necessary for the security of the State.


  57. 57 | January 2, 2014 9:17 am

    @ Guggi:

    Basically The Prince is one of the guides of the Left.


  58. 58 | January 2, 2014 9:18 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    The fact the Left takes it to heart means the Right should study it.


  59. 59 | January 2, 2014 9:18 am

    @ RIX:

    That’s what I think. If it were a gas leak, we’d have already hear about it. If it was a bomb, then we may never hear that. I know they are amazingly close-lipped about the one suicide bomber that we’ve had in the United States. That was the ‘splodeydope that blew himself (and only himself) up in Oklahoma City. They don’t even call that a suicide bombing, even though that is clearly what it is.


  60. Guggi
    60 | January 2, 2014 9:19 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Guggi:

    Basically The Prince is one of the guides of the Left.

    He is also a core element of every managment course. :-)


  61. 61 | January 2, 2014 9:21 am

    It looks like AQ has hit the Hezzies again.

    yalla souriya ‏@YallaSouriya 23s

    #LEBANON powerful explosion heard in southern Beirut. (LBC) pic.twitter.com/lEDuBLJYLa


  62. Guggi
    62 | January 2, 2014 9:22 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ Guggi:

    The Prince calls for a ruler who is “Beyond good and evil”, as it were. I can see where the postmodernists would like that. But it is also a very realistic take on power politics. At the end of the day, it is better to be feared than to be loved. Machiavelli himself was a (small “R”) republican at heart, but he saw that a ruthless ruler was what was necessary for the security of the State.

    Yup, another idea Nietzsche stole from others (in this case Machiavelli).


  63. RIX
    63 | January 2, 2014 9:23 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    I am surprised that the Media is mentioning the proximity of the Mosque.
    Only injuries, not deaths have been reported so far. So if it was bomb making they should be able tom talk to the perps, unless the injuries are too serious.


  64. 64 | January 2, 2014 9:24 am

    @ Rodan:

    It isn’t just that the Left takes it to heart. It really is a valuable work. It doesn’t get into what constitutes a just society, though. Where Machiavelli fails is when you introduce the Social Contact theory and the notion of legitimate and illegitimate governments. A totalitarian government may be best for the security and power of a State, but it is not a just society and does not have legitimacy. Something Our own rulers should be considering. A government that does not have the consent of the governed is not a legitimate government. That notion is what our entire system of government is based on. Our current government is walking a knife-edge in terms of having the Consent of the governed. The Left want to push it over that line, with the express purpose of causing a “popular uprising”. They intend to ride the wave of chaos that causes into a position of totalitarian dictatorship.


  65. 65 | January 2, 2014 9:28 am

    @ Guggi:

    Back in the ’80s and early ’90s people were reading Miamato Mushashi’s A Book of Five Rings for management courses as well. I’ve read it, and it is interesting. One of his principles is to be skilled at many things. That is something I’ve always taken to heart, and it has stood me in good stead. I’ve worked as a cook in a kitchen, ran a press-break in a sheet metal shop, been a welder and construction worker in my time in addition to being a software engineer. I’ve tried not to pigeon hole myself too much.


  66. 66 | January 2, 2014 9:29 am

    @ RIX:

    Yeah, if they’ve got the guy alive it’ll be interesting to see what is said on this. I expect that the press will quietly drop the case if it was a work accident. Look at how they’ve dropped the coverage of the Tsarnaev brothers.


  67. 67 | January 2, 2014 9:32 am

    @ Rodan:

    Indeed. Weren’t his writing influenced by his witnessing the tactics of the Borgias?


  68. 68 | January 2, 2014 9:36 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    The Left want to push it over that line, with the express purpose of causing a “popular uprising”. They intend to ride the wave of chaos that causes into a position of totalitarian dictatorship.

    Out of Chaos comes order. That is a classic modus operandi of any totalitarian movement.


  69. 69 | January 2, 2014 9:37 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Indeed. Weren’t his writing influenced by his witnessing the tactics of the Borgias?

    Yes, and Machiavelli is featured very prominent in the Borgias. He saw their methods 1st hand.


  70. 70 | January 2, 2014 9:38 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    Exactly. Caesar Borgia was Machiavelli’s model. It wasn’t so much Machiavelli praised Borgia as that he saw in him the qualities of effective leadership.


  71. 71 | January 2, 2014 9:38 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:

    I don’t know what he may do by Executive Order, though.

    He’s going to pull a Caligula and declare himself a god.

    He would also declare his horse (if he had one) a Senator and go to wedding receptions to rape the newly-married couples! The bastard.


  72. 72 | January 2, 2014 9:39 am

    It’s official.

    A powerful explosion rocked the southern district of the Lebanese capital Beirut on Thursday.

    Al Arabiya correspondent in Beirut Adnan Ghalmoush said the explosion took place in a crowded street in the Hezbollah stronghold of Beirut.

    Ghalmoush said it was caused by a car bomb, adding that security forces are opening fire in the air to keep people away from the scene of the blast.


  73. rain of lead
    73 | January 2, 2014 9:39 am

    @ Rodan:

    well it seems that not everyone in Miami is still in love with ill juice

    http://legalinsurrection.com/2014/01/when-hes-lost-little-haiti/
    Seen in Little Hait in Miami.

    Says empty promises.

    On a significant intersection, looks like something hit it, used to be a full mural.


  74. 74 | January 2, 2014 9:48 am

    @ rain of lead:

    For Haitians having a Black President does not mean anything to them. Heck they have had had them for 200 years! :lol:

    The whole deification of Obama is not really with Blacks, but with White Hipsters.


  75. darkwords
    75 | January 2, 2014 10:03 am

    @ 56 Iron Fist: A human rule can’t be beyond good and evil. Humans are interwoven with the concept. The closest productive view of the path to the person beyond good and evil is the story of Christianity.


  76. darkwords
    76 | January 2, 2014 10:06 am

    @ 63 RIX: They actually mentioned the Mosque here last night on the 6 PM news as maybe having been a possible target of anti Muslim terrorists. Then on the later edition they quoted a social justice Muslim leader as having the same wisdom.


  77. darkwords
    77 | January 2, 2014 10:10 am

    How-favorite-drink-speaks-volumes-personal-politics

    My last drinks were smoking loon which makes me a high turn out Democrat.


  78. 78 | January 2, 2014 10:13 am

    @ darkwords:

    having been a possible target of anti Muslim terrorists.

    That day will be coming, God willing.


  79. 79 | January 2, 2014 10:13 am

    @ darkwords:

    Well, they peg me. Wild Turkey gets you a high turnout Republican. Heh.


  80. Bumr50
    80 | January 2, 2014 10:18 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    @ darkwords:

    Captain Morgan transcends all!!!

    Yar!!


  81. Guggi
    81 | January 2, 2014 10:23 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    They intend to ride the wave of chaos that causes into a position of totalitarian dictatorship.

    permanent “cultural revolution” and a total fragmentation not only of the society but an insane individualization of the population. If you look at Judith Butler and her gender-argumentation, then, at the end, everyone has her/his own “gender” --> 7+B genders. But this would lead to an absurd result because no one can make anymore statements/conclusions/claims about e.g. women. Feminism (LGBT, identity groups etc. even environmentalism) would drop dead :-P Butler borrowed the idea from Nietzsche and his claims about language:

    Part of Nietzsche’s argument, that language is a lie is, that language makes unequal things equal. His example is: every leaf of every single tree is different from each other therefore we would have to find for every single leaf óf every single tree a different word but this would end any useful communication.


  82. 82 | January 2, 2014 10:33 am

    @ Guggi:

    My take on Nietzsche is that he was clinically insane. I’ve never been impressed by him in terms of his philosophy. It just seems to me that he wanted to create a world where there is no individual accountability for anything. “Beyond good and evil” there is just the banal. If you take meaning out of everything, you take meaning out of life itself. It strikes me as being philosophical suicide.


  83. RIX
    83 | January 2, 2014 10:36 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ RIX:

    Yeah, if they’ve got the guy alive it’ll be interesting to see what is said on this. I expect that the press will quietly drop the case if it was a work accident. Look at how they’ve dropped the coverage of the Tsarnaev brothers.

    There is even an effort to deny Islam as a motive for the Tsarnaev Brothers.
    It goes something like , “They weren’t treated well in America,” So it’s really our fault.


  84. RIX
    84 | January 2, 2014 10:37 am

    darkwords wrote:

    @ 63 RIX: They actually mentioned the Mosque here last night on the 6 PM news as maybe having been a possible target of anti Muslim terrorists. Then on the later edition they quoted a social justice Muslim leader as having the same wisdom.

    Because, there is so much Infidel violence against Muslims./


  85. 85 | January 2, 2014 10:37 am

    Macker wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ Iron Fist:
    I don’t know what he may do by Executive Order, though.
    He’s going to pull a Caligula and declare himself a god.

    He would also declare his horse (if he had one) a Senator and go to wedding receptions to rape the newly-married couples! The bastard.

    He wouldn’t rape the couples exactly, he’d just rape the grooms.


  86. 86 | January 2, 2014 10:39 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    Glock is introducing a .380. I, myself, am not sold on the .380 as a defensive round. It just doesn’t have the stopping power that I’d like in a carry gun. If you are going to go with a smaller caliber like that, I’d rather go with a .357 magnum. The .357 packs quite a wallop, and the recoil is very manageable.

    Er, you own a .357 magnum? In my Dan Wesson 15-4V, a 4″ barreled, rather heavy steel service revolver, it kicks like a mule. Noticeably more than an M1911A in .45 ACP (which makes sense, since it has more muzzle energy than a .45 ACP). In a lightweight, short-barreled carry revolver, it is a real handful.


  87. 87 | January 2, 2014 10:43 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    My take on Nietzsche is that he was clinically insane.

    It was documented that he descended into dementia before his death. Early onset too I think. All you can say is that he “rediscovered” Zoroastrianism in the late 19th century Europe and based most of his philosophy around that. The sad part is that his works and beliefs were hijacked by socialists and anti-Semites , two groups he did not like at all.


  88. Guggi
    88 | January 2, 2014 10:46 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    @ Guggi:

    My take on Nietzsche is that he was clinically insane. I’ve never been impressed by him in terms of his philosophy. It just seems to me that he wanted to create a world where there is no individual accountability for anything. “Beyond good and evil” there is just the banal. If you take meaning out of everything, you take meaning out of life itself. It strikes me as being philosophical suicide.

    during his life Nietzsche changed the direction of his philosophy more than once. Same did Foucault (the §ape of Nietzsche” :-P as he was once called): till around 1980 he was all for a Dionysean style of life but with 1979/1980 he became an admirer and fervant mastermind for asceticism. Since then postmodernists promote asceticism as the only way of life but only for the masses not for the elites.

    While Marxism-Leninism/Trotzcism etc. and Fascism (Nationalsocialism promised their clientel the paradise on earth once they were cuccessful (Nationalsocialism only for the “Herrenrasse”) postmodernists after 1980 promise asceticism because it is the only way to save Gaya/Mother Earth.


  89. 89 | January 2, 2014 10:47 am

    @ Mike C.:

    I’ve got two of them. Their recoil isn’t that bad. My wife can shoot them.


  90. eaglesoars
    90 | January 2, 2014 10:50 am

    RIX wrote:

    I am surprised that the Media is mentioning the proximity of the Mosque.

    I’m not. I think if the source of the explosion were the mosque, the neighboring building would not have sustained the primary damage.

    If invesitagors determine it was an explosive device they will blame it on islamophobia in action


  91. 91 | January 2, 2014 10:52 am

    @ Guggi:

    Yeah, what they want for the masses is much different than what they want for themselves. They want us living in mud huts, with the life expectancy of less than 60 years, poor medical treatment, and no hope of social mobility. They see themselves as the Master Race, often with the racial implications of that appellation. They want to build the inverse of Jim Crow, with minority privilege taking the place of white privilege, and the whites taking the place of the blacks in the social order. It is, in a word, evil. As Orwell put it, they want a boot crushing into the face of humanity forever.


  92. Guggi
    92 | January 2, 2014 10:53 am

    PaladinPhil wrote:

    Iron Fist wrote:

    My take on Nietzsche is that he was clinically insane.

    It was documented that he descended into dementia before his death. Early onset too I think. All you can say is that he “rediscovered” Zoroastrianism in the late 19th century Europe and based most of his philosophy around that. The sad part is that his works and beliefs were hijacked by socialists and anti-Semites , two groups he did not like at all.

    Not really. A great part of his philosophy (I would say a central part of it) is based on Judaism as the original religion which introduced the “slave moral” into our minds.

    Another important influence is Hindusim -- the book of Manu -, but from a distorted Tamil-source and a bad translation with many mistakes. This source was even at his time called nonsense by real experts.


  93. RIX
    93 | January 2, 2014 10:56 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    RIX wrote:

    I am surprised that the Media is mentioning the proximity of the Mosque.

    I’m not. I think if the source of the explosion were the mosque, the neighboring building would not have sustained the primary damage.

    If invesitagors determine it was an explosive device they will blame it on islamophobia in action

    If there was any damage to the Mosque I have not heard about it.
    If it was bomb making , it was in the apartment building. I just wonder if it was botched bomb making & was it by members of the Mosque. Just speculating.


  94. 94 | January 2, 2014 10:58 am

    @ Rodan:

    I’m thinking New York City is going to regret electing this walking turd before the year is out.


  95. 95 | January 2, 2014 10:59 am

    AN interesting little blurb on concealed carry. Strong correlations with a declining murder rate. I am not sure that you can prove the causal effect of it, but for the sake of gun control argument you don’t really have to. It is enough to document that allowing concealed carry doesn’t increase the murder rate. Therefore, gun control can have no positive effect on the crime rate. If it can’t effect the crime rate, there is no Constitutional fabric that allows for it.


  96. 96 | January 2, 2014 11:01 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    They elected a hard-core totalitarian Communist as Mayor. I figure that they’ve got what is coming to them. He is going to be a disaster that makes Dinkins look like presidential material.


  97. eaglesoars
    98 | January 2, 2014 11:02 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    I’m thinking New York City is going to regret electing this walking turd before the year is out.

    I think the voters got complacent. I read that only 17% voted. I haven’t seen a demographic breakdown of those voters.


  98. 99 | January 2, 2014 11:02 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Me too -- my favorite drink is any of the Robert Mondavi red wines from Napa. BTW, if anyone ever comes out this way, give me a call and we’ll take a tour of the winery!


  99. 100 | January 2, 2014 11:02 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Look at how they’ve dropped the coverage of the Tsarnaev brothers.

    Even worse, Jahar has become a pop culture icon.


  100. 101 | January 2, 2014 11:03 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    I’m thinking New York City is going to regret electing this walking turd before the year is out.

    I read turnout was only like 17% turnout. The Clintons were there at the inauguration.


  101. eaglesoars
    102 | January 2, 2014 11:04 am

    Guggi wrote:

    Popcorn anyone ?

    I wonder if those AKADEMIKS have caught onto the irony that ALL vehicles/vessels involved use fossil fuels.

    Someone should ask them where the solar panels are


  102. 103 | January 2, 2014 11:05 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    I’ve seen dumbass liberal mayors all my life here in San Francisco -- but this clown puts them all to shame.

    Yeah Dinkins is probably sitting back saying “oh man, they’ll be forgetting about my miserable term of office in six months.”


  103. 104 | January 2, 2014 11:05 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    I haven’t seen a demographic breakdown of those voters.

    Only really White Hipsters, Wall Street types and Blacks that turned out. As much as the OWS claim they are against Wall Street, most of their support is from that community.


  104. 105 | January 2, 2014 11:06 am

    Peet’s is calling my name and the gift card says “BUY SOMETHING.” BRB.


  105. eaglesoars
    106 | January 2, 2014 11:08 am

    Rodan wrote:

    Only really White Hipsters, Wall Street types and Blacks that turned out.

    linky?


  106. 107 | January 2, 2014 11:08 am

    @ Guggi:

    Heh. I think karma’s a bitch. They were in Antarctica trying to prove the sea ice is melting,, and they got stuck in the ice. How much more poetic can you get? That is even better than when the French sank the Rainbow Warrior.


  107. Guggi
    108 | January 2, 2014 11:09 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    Someone should ask them where the solar panels are

    :-)


  108. Guggi
    109 | January 2, 2014 11:10 am

    Rodan wrote:

    As much as the OWS claim they are against Wall Street, most of their support is from that community.

    Really ? Link, please ?


  109. 110 | January 2, 2014 11:11 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    @ eaglesoars:
    @ eaglesoars:

    Hillary is jumping on the DeBlasio bandwagon.

    Is New York’s de Blasio prompting a repositioning by the Clintons?


  110. eaglesoars
    111 | January 2, 2014 11:13 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    I’ve seen dumbass liberal mayors all my life here in San Francisco — but this clown puts them all to shame.

    I wonder how the gay community is accepting of a first lady who ‘used’ to be a lesbian. If sexual orientation is a choice, that changes the discussion, doesn’t it?

    oopsie.


  111. 112 | January 2, 2014 11:18 am

    @ Rodan:

    Interesting. She may decide to go full-on hard-core Leftist when she runs for President. It’ll be interesting to see where that gets her. Di Blasio couldn’t have been elected to office in most of the United States. She’d be betting on huge turnout in a relatively few cities to turn the whole thing for her. It might work. I think that’ll partly depend on whether ObamaCare continues to be a rolling disaster or not.


  112. eaglesoars
    113 | January 2, 2014 11:19 am

    Iron Fist wrote:

    She may decide to go full-on hard-core Leftist when she runs for President.

    she’s not that stupid


  113. 115 | January 2, 2014 11:21 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    You really want to give these liberals a mental hot foot? Ask them if they believe in evolution. When they inevitably answer yes, ask them if they believe homosexuality is the new normal. Again, when they inevitably answer yes, ask how homosexuality advances the evolution of the species. Watch the fun as they make funny faces and sound like a motorboat — “but..but…um…but.”


  114. 116 | January 2, 2014 11:24 am

    Oh, and can’t wait for Fatass at the Swamp and the rest of the tolerant Left have to say about the jerks on Twitter wishing death on a hospitalized Barbara Bush:

    http://weaselzippers.us/?p=166301#disqus_thread

    You know, because he was so effing apoplectic about one comment that Mandela was a commie over at Breitbart.


  115. 117 | January 2, 2014 11:26 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    I don’t think Obamacare is the magic bullet Republicans are betting it is.


  116. 118 | January 2, 2014 11:27 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    That’s mean! I like mean. Force them to acknowledge the fallacies in their stated beliefs. It is like the problem of sex-selective abortion. Talk about a war on women! They estimate about 200 million sex-selective abortions so far, 50 million or so of which were committed in China. That is a number that in any other context would be called genocide. But this involves the “sacred” right to abortion, so snuff a couple hundred million women, and the Feminists won’t say a peep about it. Abortion is, quite simply, more important than life to these people. It is no wonder that they embrace the Islamic Death Cult the way that they do. Death Cultists of a Feather flock together.


  117. 119 | January 2, 2014 11:28 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    They probably do not care since De Blasio is on their side.


  118. RIX
    120 | January 2, 2014 11:31 am

    http://weaselzippers.us/?p=166306
    Clinton claims that the biracial, bisexual de Blasio family is the wave of the future.


  119. eaglesoars
    121 | January 2, 2014 11:31 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ eaglesoars:
    They probably do not care since De Blasio is on their side.

    I think you’re half right. I think they care but won’t push it because
    DiBlasio is on their side


  120. eaglesoars
    122 | January 2, 2014 11:37 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ Guggi:
    Here you go.
    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/occupy-wall-street-gets-support-from-the-rich-1-percent-via-tumblr/
    http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/entertainment-articles/10-richest-celebrities-supporting-occupy-wall-street/
    http://www.minyanville.com/businessmarkets/articles/occupy-wall-street-wall-street-protests/10/13/2011/id/37365

    nope. doesn’t cut it. when, in a post upthread, you stated that OwS gets ‘most of its support’ from Wall Street, et. al., it was reasonable to read that as ‘financial support’

    Unless I missed something, the articles you linked to in support of your statement talk only about ‘rhetorical’ support. Yoko Ono sends her love.


  121. 124 | January 2, 2014 11:38 am

    @ RIX:

    He’s partly right that there is going to be more mixed race couples in the future. But I don’t know about Ex Lesbian part.


  122. 125 | January 2, 2014 11:38 am

    @ Rodan:

    It’s the best arrow we have in our quiver. If it won’t fly true, then we are beating our heads against a rock wall. Unemployment hasn’t derailed the Democrats Leftward march, even though they have institutionalized a Depression level of permanent unemployment. Conventional wisdom was Obama couldn’t survive the unemployment rate. That proved false. If he can force ObamaCare on us, and see himself decline as much in the polls as he has, and the Democrats still win, then we are defeated. Period. I don’t believe that that is what is going to happen, though. I think Obama and the Democrats have reached too far. Obama has already lost the House, and the GOP controls a majority of the State Houses and Governorships. You focus so much on the negative that you refuse to see any positives.


  123. Guggi
    126 | January 2, 2014 11:42 am

    @ Rodan:

    Thank, Rodan !


  124. 127 | January 2, 2014 11:42 am

    @ RIX:

    Biracial, sure, but so what? I have American Indian blood in me. I am technically “mixed race”. My ex-wife was part black. None of that means that either one of us would vote Democrat. I think as mixed race becomes the norm, race itself will become less important. That is, if you think about it, the “Dream” MLK had. Race doesn’t matter, really, or shouldn’t. I think blacks are doing themselves long-term disservice by being so unshakably solid in their support of the Democrats. As we have seen with the Obama Administration, the Democrats don’t care if black unemployment is 20%.


  125. 128 | January 2, 2014 11:42 am

    @ Rodan:

    Yet Mitt Romney’s son is excoriated in the mainstream press for his adoption of a Black child. Hey liberals -- make up your damn minds!


  126. eaglesoars
    129 | January 2, 2014 11:43 am

    doriangrey wrote:

    To ridicule or not to ridicule, that is the question.

    see my #102


  127. RIX
    130 | January 2, 2014 11:43 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ RIX:

    He’s partly right that there is going to be more mixed race couples in the future. But I don’t know about Ex Lesbian part.

    Right, the mixed race thing makes some sense, but how many guys will really marry an ex lesbian?
    How many ex lesbians are there anyway?


  128. 131 | January 2, 2014 11:44 am

    @ Iron Fist:

    Democrats LIKE Black employment at 20% -- keeps them on the Government Plantation. Their biggest fear is that conservatives will find a way to stimulate the economy for real and create jobs.


  129. RIX
    132 | January 2, 2014 11:45 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:

    Yet Mitt Romney’s son is excoriated in the mainstream press for his adoption of a Black child. Hey liberals — make up your damn minds!

    I’m surprised that they didn’t accuse Romney of photo shopping the Black baby.


  130. 133 | January 2, 2014 11:45 am

    @ RIX:

    As eaglesoars pointed out above -- if you’re BORN that way, as they have always maintained, how can you now be an ex-lesbian. I can’t be an ex-blue eyed blonde female! I can’t be an ex-caucasian.


  131. 135 | January 2, 2014 11:46 am

    @ RIX:

    Notice that they have never said a word about celebrities like Madonna adopting Black babies from Africa like it was this year’s fashion accessory.


  132. eaglesoars
    136 | January 2, 2014 11:47 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    Yet Mitt Romney’s son is excoriated in the mainstream press for his adoption of a Black child.

    to be fair, I don’t consider MSNBC to be mainstream. Let alone Melissa Harris-Perry, who for some reason I don’t recall, thought she was making a point by wearing ‘earrings’ constructed from tampons.


  133. 137 | January 2, 2014 11:49 am

    @ Carolina Girl:

    I agree. It is amazing to me that the Democrats, who were the party of slavery in the Civil War and the party of segregation and the Klan during the Civil Rights struggle, take 90-95% of the black vote over the Republicans, who freed the salves and voted for the Civil Rights acts that completed the process of freeing the blacks. That is just stunning to me. It suggests that actions don’t matter much to the black community. That they are more easily swayed by pure rhetoric (not backed by actions) than other demographics. I don’t know what you do about that. I am big on voter education efforts, but if the target population doesn’t want to be educated, there’s not a whole lot that you can do about it.


  134. RIX
    138 | January 2, 2014 11:50 am

    @ Iron Fist:
    Mixed race in common in the “New World”. Nobody cares, but Clinton was trying to make it avant garde.
    But, I am betting that most guys won’t marry ex lesbians.


  135. eaglesoars
    139 | January 2, 2014 11:50 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ eaglesoars:
    Who do you think is funding OWS? Rich Wall Street Progressives.
    http://www.minyanville.com/businessmarkets/articles/occupy-wall-street-wall-street-protests/10/13/2011/id/37365
    http://www.minyanville.com/businessmarkets/articles/occupy-wall-street-wall-street-protests/10/13/2011/id/37365

    not ONE article cites actual funding. so until I get actual facts, I don’t think anything.


  136. Speranza
    141 | January 2, 2014 11:51 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Iron Fist:
    Democrats LIKE Black employment at 20% — keeps them on the Government Plantation. Their biggest fear is that conservatives will find a way to stimulate the economy for real and create jobs.

    Blacks are doing worse in Obama’s economy but racial loyalty trumps all. Few recall that Nixon got 37% of the Black vote in 1960.


  137. RIX
    142 | January 2, 2014 11:52 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ RIX:

    Notice that they have never said a word about celebrities like Madonna adopting Black babies from Africa like it was this year’s fashion accessory.

    And Angelina Jolie.


  138. Speranza
    143 | January 2, 2014 11:52 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    to be fair, I don’t consider MSNBC to be mainstream. Let alone Melissa Harris-Perry, who for some reason I don’t recall, thought she was making a point by wearing ‘earrings’ constructed from tampons.

    Decades ago she would have passed herself off as White.


  139. 144 | January 2, 2014 11:53 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    So you really don’t think that these same Wall Street types that support the Democrats do not fund OWS?


  140. eaglesoars
    145 | January 2, 2014 11:53 am

    RIX wrote:

    And Angelina Jolie.

    And John McCain’s wife.


  141. RIX
    146 | January 2, 2014 11:54 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ RIX:

    As eaglesoars pointed out above — if you’re BORN that way, as they have always maintained, how can you now be an ex-lesbian. I can’t be an ex-blue eyed blonde female! I can’t be an ex-caucasian.

    That’s what I have always heard. The Left ridicules religious types who try to pray people straight, saying that it isn’t possible.
    Maybe De Blasio thinks that they can go to bars to meet women together.


  142. RIX
    147 | January 2, 2014 11:55 am

    eaglesoars wrote:

    RIX wrote:

    And Angelina Jolie.

    And John McCain’s wife.

    That’s true.


  143. 148 | January 2, 2014 11:56 am

    @ eaglesoars:

    MSNBC doesn’t have the ratings to be considered “mainstream”. I think Fox is changing the Demographic of what is “mainstream” today. Their ratings are just too high for the rest of the media to ignore. You see few reporters outside of Fox that are willing to challenge the Leftist narrative that the other Stations try to push. Fox isn’t really “right-wing”. They really are simply more balanced. They will put forward the competing right-wing narrative, whereas the rest of the media tries its best to ignore that it even exists. It isn’t so much a statement of where Fox is as it is the unremitting Leftist bias in the rest of the media market. You can’t treat half the country like they are uneducated hicks and expect to sell yourself in today’s market.


  144. eaglesoars
    149 | January 2, 2014 11:56 am

    Rodan wrote:

    @ eaglesoars:
    So you really don’t think that these same Wall Street types that support the Democrats do not fund OWS?

    The point is I HAVE NO FACTS. I am an evidence-based kinda girl.


  145. 150 | January 2, 2014 11:57 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ Rodan:
    Yet Mitt Romney’s son is excoriated in the mainstream press for his adoption of a Black child. Hey liberals — make up your damn minds!

    They ended up looking like assholes there.


  146. 152 | January 2, 2014 11:59 am

    Carolina Girl wrote:

    @ RIX:
    As eaglesoars pointed out above — if you’re BORN that way, as they have always maintained, how can you now be an ex-lesbian. I can’t be an ex-blue eyed blonde female! I can’t be an ex-caucasian.

    Quit trying to be rational or logical you homophobic bigot… :twisted:


  147. eaglesoars
    153 | January 2, 2014 12:01 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    MSNBC doesn’t have the ratings to be considered “mainstream”. I think Fox is changing the Demographic of what is “mainstream” today. Their ratings are just too high for the rest of the media to ignore.

    what is bewildering to me is to watch CNN go the way of MSNBC. Anderson Cooper and Kathy Griffin on New Years Eve? Srsly?


  148. heysoos
    154 | January 2, 2014 12:01 pm

    eaglesoars wrote:

    Rodan wrote:
    @ eaglesoars:
    So you really don’t think that these same Wall Street types that support the Democrats do not fund OWS?

    The point is I HAVE NO FACTS. I am an evidence-based kinda girl.

    same here, speculation and guessing is just that


  149. 155 | January 2, 2014 12:02 pm

    RIX wrote:

    The Left ridicules religious types who try to pray people straight, saying that it isn’t possible.

    And nobody is more vicious towards anyone leaving the homosexual community either. Yes, I have known people who left the homosexual community, you would not believe how they were treated by their previous “Friends”…


  150. eaglesoars
    156 | January 2, 2014 12:03 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ eaglesoars:
    Here is more.
    http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052970203833004577249811049566178

    EGGSELENT!! See what you can do when I ride your ass to get it right?


  151. 157 | January 2, 2014 12:05 pm

    @ eaglesoars:

    Yeah, it is clear that they have an agenda that they’d rather push than be economically viable in the long run. I am surprised MSNBC is still on the air. They are really a niche market, and even there it is a market with lots of competition. One of the reasons that Fox is such a runaway success is that they are the only business in their market. A Liberal can go to any of the Alphabet Soup networks and hear their talking points being spread. If you want a right-wing perspective to even be uttered, you’ve got Fox, and that really is it (in broadcast/cable television).


  152. eaglesoars
    158 | January 2, 2014 12:05 pm

    doriangrey wrote:

    Yes, I have known people who left the homosexual community,

    hey dorian! could you explain what that means, please? Does it mean they stopped being activists, stopped being gay?………….


  153. eaglesoars
    159 | January 2, 2014 12:07 pm

    Iron Fist wrote:

    I am surprised MSNBC is still on the air.

    Because they’re spending somebody else’s money. Comcast I believe.


  154. RIX
    160 | January 2, 2014 12:07 pm

    doriangrey wrote:

    RIX wrote:

    The Left ridicules religious types who try to pray people straight, saying that it isn’t possible.

    And nobody is more vicious towards anyone leaving the homosexual community either. Yes, I have known people who left the homosexual community, you would not believe how they were treated by their previous “Friends”…

    It seems to be a common trait on the Left. If you deviate from the herd they try to destroy you.
    There is a blog like that, little Green Nerf Balls , or something


  155. 161 | January 2, 2014 12:08 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    It’s not about ratings for MSNBC. It’s to get the narrative out. The people who watch MSNBC shape public opinion.


  156. 162 | January 2, 2014 12:09 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    I personally know a Lesbian who flipped. But I always felt the Lesbian thing was an act on her part.


  157. 163 | January 2, 2014 12:10 pm

    @ eaglesoars:

    I’m sure you are right, there. Whose money, I wonder? George Soros could prop them up indefinitely. Al Jazeera already has a propaganda outlet in the United States, so they wouldn’t need MSNBC.


  158. 164 | January 2, 2014 12:12 pm

    New Thread.


  159. 165 | January 2, 2014 12:13 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    Soros and the Marxist Wall Street cabal like Goldmann Sachs.


  160. eaglesoars
    166 | January 2, 2014 12:14 pm

    I’ve got to do the financials today so I’m out. later


  161. 167 | January 2, 2014 12:15 pm

    @ Rodan:

    Some of them, sure, but I bet you that some of them also watch Fox News. There isn’t a secret cabal of People Who Shape Public Opinion. You are talking about mainly DC people. The same people who are getting rich off of Big Government. But the Left’s ability to control the narrative is much less today than it was even during the Clinton Administration. They’ve gotten more strident in their message, and less tolerant of any conflicting views, but their degree of control is much less. Look at the work Shyrl Attkisson has done at CBS, of all places.


  162. 168 | January 2, 2014 12:16 pm

    eaglesoars wrote:

    stopped being gay?………….

    Stopped being gay, as in, decided they were into the opposite sex.

    Rodan wrote:

    @ doriangrey:
    I personally know a Lesbian who flipped. But I always felt the Lesbian thing was an act on her part.

    In the homosexual community, there is no pretending, no bisexual, no experimentation. Have sex once with someone of the same sex, and you are gay, decide to go back to heterosexual practices and you are a traitor. Believe me, they are utterly ruthless and vicious to people who do that. Former band members of bands I were in went through it, really really ugly.


  163. 169 | January 2, 2014 12:17 pm

    @ doriangrey:

    They are Marxists, of course they are ruthless. 100 Million killed over the last 100 years who agree!


  164. 170 | January 2, 2014 12:19 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    But the Left’s ability to control the narrative is much less today than it was even during the Clinton

    They are more effective now than ever. They have assembled the best political machine assembled in human history.


  165. 171 | January 2, 2014 12:22 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    @ doriangrey:
    They are Marxists, of course they are ruthless. 100 Million killed over the last 100 years who agree!

    Way more than 100 million (the Chinese aborted 150 million in the last 50 years) but your point is well taken.


  166. 172 | January 2, 2014 12:24 pm

    Rodan wrote:

    They have assembled the best political machine assembled in human history.

    You keep saying that, and it keeps being false. The Nazis and Soviets both had propaganda machines that make what the Left has in America look like nothing. How effective has OFA been in getting Obama’s second term agenda passed?


  167. 173 | January 2, 2014 12:35 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    It’s not about Obama’s 2nd term agenda. It’s about keeping power and setting up Democrat dominance at the Presidential level. Look at the shutdown and how they thoroughly trashed the GOP. with a combined Media/Pop Culture assault.


  168. 174 | January 2, 2014 12:41 pm

    @ Rodan:

    And how far has that really gotten them? They aren’t going to take the House this year. That really isn’t in the cards. They will most likely lose some seats in the Senate as well, though it is too early right now to predict what is going to happen with the Senate. Could the Republicans have handled the shut down more effectively? Absolutely, and I blame the Party Mandarins for that, not the Tea Party Republicans. As I said when it happened, we’re going to have to wait to see who won and who lost the shutdown politics. Little (mostly biased) snap polls don’t tell us much about what the electorate will do during an election.


  169. 175 | January 2, 2014 1:32 pm

    @ Iron Fist:

    They should not have fallen for the Democrats trap. Fact is both the GOP Elites and Tea Party got their asses handed to them. Nothing on the Right matches the Leftist machine.


  170. Icekoldebassman
    176 | January 3, 2014 1:41 pm

    @ Rodan:

    This is also a “must read”.

    http://www.amazon.com/Todays-ISMS-Socialism-Capitalism-Libertarianism/dp/0130257141


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